Kind: captions
Language: en
hey everybody welcome to another episode
of startup Theory we are here today with
Jesse da of grit and diamonds which is a
coffee scrub um which is going to be
interesting to hear all about that
coffee and salt if I'm not mistaken so
uh brace yourselves he's actually in the
middle of a start start Kickstarter I'm
having a stroke I'm having a stroke he's
in the middle of a Kickstarter campaign
right now I think it ends in two hours
right 12:20 p.m. all right so he's hit
his minimum already um but it's a pretty
intriguing product so I encourage you
guys to go check it out see what it's
all about if it seems like something
that you're going to be into it's got
sustainability stuff going on which um
Jesse will tell us all about in a second
but very very interesting you guys
should go check it out on Kickstarter
you can also go to grit and diamonds.com
if you want to learn more about the
product Jesse and his team or anything
in between so all right without further
Ado Jesse tell us a little bit about
your company if you
all right um background coffee expert
spent 10 years in the industry wanted to
get back into the industry uh in a
different format I came up with this
idea uh that I seen kind of going around
from business to business using coffee
as an exfoliant so uh I love the idea of
using coffee and salts almond butters
Shea Butters essential oils for Roman
therapeutic benefits uh to to enrich the
the skin on your body and wanted to get
into it but one of the problems I had
with the Cosmetic industry is the
significant amount of waste that's been
added to lils due to tubes plastic
containers I mean if you go take a look
in the shower or under your sink you're
going to see tons of plastic so I wanted
to ensure that we packaged everything in
completely compostable certified
compostable packaging which is literally
just a coffee bag with a food grade
nontoxic stickers on the front and
looking to kind of stick it to the
Cosmetic industry and say hey if a if a
small startup based out of Vancouver can
um introduce a cosmetic line using based
products and eliminate waste then why
can't some of the bigger organizations
very cool and so tell me a little bit
about I know that you uh were in the the
selling game for a while and then you
went to Corporate America and I think
your exact quote was this am I
mistaken on that uh tell us about why
you um why you went to Corporate America
briefly and then why you
left so yeah I I was in um in the coffee
business for like I said 8 years uh with
an organiz ation out of Calgary Alberta
they're fantastic to work for still
great friends with the CEO today uh but
I fell in love moved out to Vancouver uh
Chase Chase love um and uh started up a
painting franchise got into the service
based industry got to work with um was
was it student painting uh it was called
wild one day painting it's a newer
franchise model uh maybe about 3 years
old it's out of a brand called OE if
you've heard of the company 1800 got
junk it fits underneath that umbrella so
I got to relaunch one one of their
painting
franchises and um it was great was off
out of the gates um as I think I
mentioned shaking hands kissing babies
closing contracts it was great and then
the world has a funny way of uh sending
you a few uppercuts and reminding you
that business is still business and it's
tough so um ended up after eight months
soon realized maybe the service based
industry wasn't necessary for me I was
firing more people than I was hiring uh
decided to take a step back go into
sales again that's where I joined
Corporate America and it took yeah maybe
90 days to realize uh this it's not
for me and uh I did a pretty immediate
exit I just found myself to be like a
number um it was more about what you
were doing in a day not the quality of
what you were doing so I just took some
time off to reevaluate and think okay
well what I want to do and that's where
um I knew I had this deep passion for
coffee I got to travel to Coffee growing
regions around the world work directly
with Farmers Source sustainable
ethically sourced coffee and I want to
get back into it but not necessarily
jumping into the competitive coffee
Market that 80% of people consume so I
uh I started uh gr and diamonds coffee
uh coffee scrubs wow very cool um so
there's a lot of fascinating stuff in
there that I'm actually super tempted uh
I refer to Jared as my conscience so I
sort of checking with him to see uh if I
could totally derais but I won't um
really really interested though in some
of the things you're going through that
I think really will resonate um I I
think there's a huge movement happening
right now and I'm just going to go on
record so Jared has been preaching gen z
um and it's really captured my
imagination and you're quite young so I
think there's you're sort of on the cusp
between Millennials and gen z uh
Millennials are a little bit older than
than I had thought so gen Z I think is
uh some they're really going to resonate
with what you're doing with compostables
and um sticking it to the Man a bit and
getting outside of corpit America I
think that's really really uh
fascinating so but why don't we Dive
Right into your questions you have some
great questions and I think people are
going to get a lot out of this so um
rather than take us down the jenzy Rat
Hole uh I will just say um why don't we
dive in question one cool awesome I I
appreciate that and and um I'm not a
millennial well I guess I would be a
millennial I'm 31 years old so uh
wow fantastic the Next Generation as
well I find it quite challenging it's
outside of my box so hopefully you can
help me with some of these questions so
definitely um one of the first questions
I have is I'm a big believer in give
give give um and reaching out to
influencers obviously we live in a world
where people build trust based off what
an influencer is doing um I I'm from the
generation where I did research on
things and I think people will buy based
on who's consuming the product such as
Instagram when it comes to reaching out
to an audience what did you do for Quest
how did you seek influencers what was
the protocol what was said was it like h
on my product like what's the best
practice that you did to get your like
Quest into the into the market so the
the big thing there is to really
identify who has a voice to the people
that you care about that are really
going to be your customer and this is
critical and we'll talk more about this
in in one of your later questions as
well um so identifying your market like
who right now are you solving a problem
for and that's a a big thing like there
needs to be a group of people out there
that are waiting they're chomping at the
bit for your product otherwise it's
going to be an uphill slog and I've
talked a lot about this before it's
about leveraging Behavior not about
trying to change Behavior if you if
you're in the game of changing Behavior
you've got a really long and painful
road ahead of you but if you're able to
leverage it even if you're trying to
leverage Behavior to get people to do
something new or to um get a
dramatically different result you want
to leverage something that's existing so
if you think about habit Loops you want
to be replacing something and that is um
it's just going to give a lot of
momentum to you so find that group who
are the people that want this product so
uh I mean if you're an exfoliant you're
you're not going after um probably 20s
something guys because they're not
thinking about that right they're not
thinking about beauty youth is on their
side and so um there's a lot of
effortlessness to their routine and I
don't know that your product would
address that but women obviously are
much more fascinated uh with Beauty with
beauty products um and so I would be
going after the influencers that I know
speak very well in that market so if you
think of somebody like I believe her
name is Michelle Fan with an N I should
have looked this up um but she's one of
the uh biggest YouTubers she was just on
the cover or is about to be on the o it
hasn't come out yet so I'm not sure we
should wow well we'll stop there oh good
uh but she's being taken very
seriously she being being taken very
seriously and uh she's built a huge
following in this space so um she's
known for uh beauty products so she
would be at the upper end of that
Spectrum somebody I think she has multi
million followers on YouTube I would
assume the same holds true for Instagram
Twitter um so if you think of her sort
of as as being at the Apex so that group
of people that you want to go after and
then you sort of scale down from there
and find people that really are going to
not only care about your product they're
going to understand it and that's what
you need so at Quest we went after
people that we knew would understand
what we had done with our product and
that ended up being a really big deal
because we didn't have to explain it to
them so we could send it to them and and
we so we identified who they were we
knew that they meant something to the
audience that we were trying to attract
the problem the group of people that
cared about the problem that we were
solving and that when they turned over
the product and read the ingredients
that they would understand it they would
get the things not only the things that
were in there they would understand the
things that weren't in there so you
don't want to be in the business of
having to explain this to people you
don't want to be in the business of
having to explain to somebody that hey
this is a compostable bag and let me
explain to what composting is is where
something biodegrades right you want
somebody who looks at that and goes whoo
this biodegrades an 18 months you have
to be kidding like nothing else like
this is on the market this is crazy so
that they're often running with it and
the moment that you have to be sitting
there explaining um your features and
benefits you're really really in trouble
so go after um and then make sure that
you're going after not just the top of
the pyramid the Michelle fans of the
world but that you're also going all the
way down to somebody that maybe has five
or 10 thousand people you get enough of
those people that are really speaking in
a super meaningful way authentic way
they're connected they have a really
engaged audience that's super critical
and for any of you guys out there that
are interested in influencer marketing
I'm telling you right now engagement
engagement is the name of the game it is
not about the vanity metrics of
followers it's really about are people
engaging are they commenting are they
liking are they sharing so reach is a
big deal making sure that the people
that you're engaging with have
tremendous reach reach is really defined
as how many people share their content
when somebody shares the content you
know one that they really um believe in
it that their fans are um they want to
help spread that message so if you find
somebody that gets a lot of shares in
their content and that those shares
reach a lot of people that's where their
waiting gold so they the influencer
themselves may only be followed by 5,000
people but if they have huge reach it
means that there's people following them
that have a bigger knock on effect so
that can be really really valuable and
there are tools out there that help you
identify the influencers and the people
that have reached then from there and
this is the important part you need to
find an authentic connection with those
people and that was something that I'm
really proud of the way that we handle
the quest was we understood that it's
about really reaching out to somebody
that we understand we know what their
value proposition is and we know that we
can actually help them do something
great for their followers and so that
was where we started and we wrote them
um very detailed letter that explained
to them that we knew who they were that
we understood the value that they were
trying to bring to their community and
that we felt that our product was going
to do that and so we sent them the
product for free and we said all we want
you to do is tell people about it if you
love it tell them you love it but if you
hate it tell them you hate it like we're
not trying to control the script and
that ended up becoming something that we
became known for was you know and this
is you talking like six years ago now
when influencers were just beginning to
understand what a brand relationship
look like and so Brands were beginning
to give them contractual um stuff and
they sorry I'm blanking because Cindy
what's up home girl welcome back it is
so good to have you back so Cindy's been
gone she has been horrifyingly missed
and it is very very good to have her
back so now I can think again that I
have greeted uh Cindy so that was really
really important and um making sure that
you're you know bringing it all the way
around that it's something that's going
to be valuable to their community that
is something that um is is super
authentic that really is the the way
that you approach influencers and when
if you're not trying to control the
script um then you're going to set
yourself apart from all the other brands
that are um and and so like I was saying
six years ago when this was really
beginning for Quest everyone was trying
to say to the influencer you need to say
you need to mention us this many times a
month you need to say these exact words
and we said nah we don't need you to do
any of that like we just want to really
bring authentic value to you and if we
deliver that then our belief about
humans is you're going to talk about it
and so I think that's the
strategy yeah you know it's I've I've
seen both sides of that where people say
hey we want you to reach out to us you
know you want to do three or four shout
outs for us and it just seemed a very in
authentic and building a long-term
relationship with that influencer so I
appreciate that it's almost a sense of
validation and just kind of be natural
with with building that relationship
yeah for sure and you you said in some
of your comments that you're a patient
guy um I I respond super negatively to
the word patience but actually know what
you mean if you're willing to play the
game for a long time which I think is
much more important to focus on than
being patient I say don't be patient but
do play the long game um so knowing that
yeah they might not bite right way at
the beginning but that if you're focused
on building that authentic real
relationship and one thing you you
really should do is be super active in
their communities make sure that you're
one of those people that are liking
commenting sharing because you know
speaking um as somebody that you know at
Quest we had millions of people
following here at impact Theory we um
edging up towards 100,000 people in the
community but the people that are active
I see them like I know who they are I
know their usernames I've clicked on
their accounts I've looked at their
stuff um so I'm aware of who they are
because they're they ever present in our
community and they're really adding
value to us because you know our big ask
and I'm I'm sure that um you'll have a
very similar ask which is hey be active
right let us know what's working what's
not working share the content and so
when people are actually doing that and
adding value to you you get into this
you know um a a wonderful relationship
it it's social in nature social media
it's not you know the same as the person
who's going to be the best men at your
wedding but it it is um I find very very
valuable
enjoyable um and and you know it takes
time so you just have to to be there be
present and deliver value to
First awesome um all right on the next
question here how's my is is it still
working over there yeah we've somehow
done the zoom backin thing and your um
the the quality is a little bit lower
but man they can hear your your
wonderful voice you'll be fine beautiful
beautiful okay
um I'm going to shoot I'm going to shoot
around some of these questions Bas based
on the ANS You' been G me so when it
comes to hiring your first three
employees in 2007 uh what would you look
for are you hiring a COO right away
Warehouse Logistics you know someone to
help with formulas um how would you plan
your hiring test from your first you
know one to three employees so you need
to read a book called The e- Myth
Revisited by Michael Gerber um it's it's
really I think one of the most important
books for any upstart entrepreneur to
read because he has this really
important Concept in there called you
want to be working on your business not
in your business so um I'm going to
guess that the because you're good at
marketing and selling and that's been
your background my gut instinct is
you're going to want to hire somebody to
do your bookkeeping it's going to be
somebody focused on finance because
you're going to lose a lot of time to
that especially if you're not good at it
um so you could get good you could learn
it but you know you want to talk about
something that'll just really really
consume a lot of your time when you
could get a part-time bookkeeper um to
take a lot of that stuff off your plate
and so it really comes down to cuz that
that's not Universal advice right so
that's specific to you um that may be uh
true for a lot of people but you really
want to go in and identify what are the
things that are going to suck up my time
because at the end of the day sales
solves everything if you're not selling
you've that's like the number one
problem so sales and marketing Trump
everything else those need to be the you
know the the focus beyond the product so
get the product right you need a great
product because if you don't have a
great product then all the sales and the
marketing in the world just going to
erode um your business model because
people are going to realize hey I bought
this because you have great sales and
marketing but it's actually a bad
product so I'm going to make the
assumption that you you have something
in your product there was something
either you've already worked with the
formulator or you are the formulator and
you were able to come up with something
that that's winning if you don't have
that then that for sure is step one but
assuming that we have a great product
and you're able to do the sales and
marketing then you want to go on to what
are going to be the things that are
going to eat up your time that aren't
value add to the sales process and the
sales process in the long run right so
not just getting the first sale but the
great news is you have a consumable
business and being in the the world of
consumables is awesome because now you
have multiple times to touch people and
when you're a value ad company when your
sales your marketing your social
strategy everything is about value ad
now you're in the business of the more
times I touch you the more likely you
are to come back and buy the product
again that is a a solution for just
tremendous longevity and that's one of
the reasons that Quest was so successful
and one of the reasons that because of
what's happening in social media that
that really is where people have to
apply their focus is to be thinking
about earning trust through every
interaction you want to be evangelizing
your customer at every touch point
because especially in the consumable
business now they're going to become
dieh hard they're going to be loyal
they're going to be there for years and
years and that's how the business really
becomes sustainable so you want to look
at hiring people that are going to um
alleviate anything that's going to stop
you from adding value to that sales
cycle uh so gut instinct here is it
would be
Finance cool I appreciate that yeah for
sure um I know you're a big believer in
giving Equity to the uh to individuals
that come on your first hires uh
employers now I understand this isn't
leg advice I'm asking for more of just a
perspective how do you take that
approach you could very quickly give out
a big chunk of the company um which
could could leave you pretty volatile so
you know in and again best practice how
would you say to offer equity in the
company shares in the company and I
understand we're a very small st we've
just made our first sales but this is
something to think about when hiring
ensuring that people are coming on
because they believe in the product
they're here for the long game and they
want to be a part of something big and
um and there's there's some Sweat Equity
in there for them yeah so this is
incredibly complicated and one of the
few times that even I feel compelled to
say a disclaimer normally my team has to
beat me into doing disclaimers um this
is not legal advice I am not a lawyer so
I will just seek legal Council on this
one um I'll just give you some of the
things that um you should be thinking
about so one it's typical to give away
between 10 and 20% of your company um I
don't think anybody's going to sneeze at
that I could see going a little bit
north of that probably doesn't make a
lot of sense to go too much farther
north of that unless people are giving
um they're pledging money to the company
um and I think the initial group of
people you want to be probably somewhere
in the 10% giveout range so whoever's on
the founding team think about giving
away 10% of the company to them um the
reason is you want to leave upside
because inevitably as you grow you're
going to need to give away more of the
company to attract higher caliber talent
and that goes on for a very long time so
um to give you an idea Quest is still
offering Equity to um high high level
hires when they come out of the company
now and you know this is what six seven
years into the company so um you want to
make sure that you have that pool of
equity that you're thinking into the
future and I assume what you meant by
you can get yourself in a volatile
situation um has more to do with voting
rights than just giving away equity in
the company so um as a startup I would
not give away voting rights I would give
away um a common class of shares that
don't have voting rights and also one
thing that I would and the reason that
you want to do that is um you want to
maintain control of the company and when
people buy a piece of your company then
normally they do um depending on how
much they're almost certainly going to
demand voting rights uh so you can
rapidly get yourself into a situation
where you're making decisions to please
the board rather than to do what's right
for the company in the long run uh
because the board is thinking usually 3
to 5 years is an exit maybe seven on the
outside I'm trying to help birth a
movement called The Evergreen movement
which is started by a guy named Dave
Wharton um which is I think the it's not
right for everybody but I think that
it's it's such a viable um alternative
strategy which is where people make
money off of dividends so they get
ownership but they're really paid out in
dividends versus um them ever expecting
to sell and that's certainly how we've
structured the company here nobody's
expecting um a big exit hey if it
happens and for whatever reason we
decide in the future that that's what
we're going to do um so be it but like
you'll notice all of my socials are SLT
billu it's not slth company um just
because you know who knows uh what comes
in the future but right now we don't
have any intention of selling the
company and so it's really a dividend
play it's about um you know excess cash
we'll call it I won't derail us now on
that but um so one thing that you can do
since you're not going to be I would
advise in my non-legal opinion um you
not to give away um any voting rights
that you want to you can do things like
hey hey guys here I'm giving you this
amount of equity maybe it's 1% maybe
it's 2% to your founding team member uh
but I also need you to sign pre-sign
this document saying that if you leave
the company for any reason um within the
next 5 years or maybe longer some people
you know do this forever um but if you
leave the company at before X period of
time that you return your shares to
Treasury and so that it's already
pre-signed and so if you guys decide to
part ways that you know you've got
something in writing um again you this
kind of thing that you want to get
drafted by a lawyer um if you just
cannot afford that I'm sure that there's
stuff online but this is the kind of
thing man you do not divorce the same
person that you marry okay let's all let
that one sink in for a second you do not
divorce the same person that you marry
so the people that you love right now
and you can't imagine like anything ever
going wrong it can and at that moment
like people see things from their own
perspective it's human nature no need to
be angry about it but it's human nature
and so the likely of them seeing things
the way that you see it are virtually
zero so you want to make sure that um
you've had some sort of pre-arranged
agreement on what happens at that moment
now yeah so I mean I've got my my whole
take on that uh about what that does to
a relationship so you have to be careful
but that's the most prudent advice um
I'll just give quickly a flip side to
that coin when you have people sign
prenups um it it's weird and it does
something weird to the relationship so
anyway something to think about um we've
taken a slightly different approach here
which is so we have a vesting period And
if people um leave before the vesting
period Then you know they would get
nothing for that other than whatever
they got from a dividend perspective
while they were still here um and I
think people should be in an evergreen
model anyway way more concerned about
sharing in the excess cash flow um than
they are the equity because if you don't
ever plan to sell then um you've you
know you've got nothing but um it does
having that Equity ownership makes
people not to pretend that they're an
owner not have to act like an owner but
they actually are an owner and so I
think it aligns selfish
desires totally I just realized we could
do like a whole episode on that but
that's awesome that non-legal advice
yeah non-legal advice um okay here's
here's a big vulnerability for me and
this is something that is is probably my
biggest vulnerability when starting this
company up
um I'm I'm an passionate guy I'm very
outgoing I can communicate to 99 % of
people I'm great at getting on a on a
deep level someone however when it comes
to communicating in a written form I'm
garbage like I'm I'm actually just
garbage at it and I know you focus so
much on mindset and and I have this um I
have this battle where I um unveil as a
term that you were using where I unv the
ability to structure just great
sentences and in startup phase a lot of
the content is coming from me and it's
it's an online store so it requires that
so I'm very much a go go go go go kind
of person I don't like to St too much um
having my stuff edited and it's it's
it's slows me down especially when you
kind of got a Kickstarter you got to
continually engage with your audience um
what advice do you have around that
someone that uh you feel would I I don't
know where you are until actually with
with with written language um something
I struggle with any feedback on that
yeah man so in your notes and hopefully
you're not um not saying this out loud
because you didn't want it out loud but
um in your notes anyway you said that
you're dyslexic and being dyslexic is a
superpower now it's a superpower that
has like a a weird side effect that
you're not enjoying which is that the
written language can be very difficult
um but read the book disrupt You by J
samit not only does he give a list of
the most incredible human beings that
are dyslexic from Steve Jobs to Richard
Branson um I just read something said
Steven Spielberg is I don't know if
that's true but um that there in in the
book and I don't remember them all off
the top of my head but he goes through
like literally seven or eight of
self-made billionaires who were all
dyslexic and he said the reason is that
in school it definitely seems like a
deficiency because of your difficulty
with the written language but actually
the way that a dyslexic mind works is
that they see problems much more
holistically and they're able to make
connections that other people don't make
that get so myopically focused on one
detail and I thought that was really
fascinating and does explain why so many
dyslexics go on to be so successful
because they're able to really really
succeed in the world of being an
entrepreneur because they're able to
make these unique connections they're
able to um put things together that
other people might not see solutions to
problems where other people just see the
problem they actually see this sort of
holistic global view of how oh no wait
if you actually you know build a bridge
from here to here now you've really got
something so um I you know going back to
what you're saying about my obsession
with mindset I would really really
really encourage you to reframe in your
mind thank God a dyslexic I'm like God
this is going to work out so amazingly
yes I have to hire a copywriter when
it's something that's going to be
forward- facing so for the website or
really important email to um say a
potential investor or something like
that yes then I will work with a
copywriter which now are so easy to find
and like upwork and things like that but
I'm so grateful that I have this
superpower that allows me to see things
more holistically that's probably one of
the neurological firing patterns that's
made me so good at sales that's made it
easy for me to um conceptualize a
business and grow a business um so I'm
super grateful for that and all of a
sudden it just takes the edge off of um
a the insecurity of like if you knew
that being dyslexic actually made you a
more effective entrepreneur isn't it a
relatively small price to pay um to not
be good at sending emails yes especially
because you can speak to people very
easily that you don't have a hard time
conveying the ideas you have a hard time
writing them down and so eh like that's
a relatively minor thing thing there's
people that you can leverage to help you
with that and so it becomes much more
important to have the problem solving
skills that seem to be um tied to being
dyslexic so that I I would just look at
it that way um and you know being
insecure about it doesn't serve you so I
wouldn't be insecure and it's just about
it's in the beginning like you're going
to say that to yourself it's not going
to be very effective but you start doing
that for a year two years and all of a
sudden you're going to be giving talks
like to kids that have dyslexia about
how advantageous it is and one day
you're going to step back and go whoa
I'm actually totally
um like I believe that to the core of my
being now just because I've been saying
it I've been looking for evidence that
proves that and so you just get into
this bubble of positivity around
something that up to this point has been
a negative so yeah I wouldn't sweat it
is the long and the
short cool man really appreciate that
for
ways
um all right I'll jump back up here um I
mean given what you know about uh the
small amount that you know about the
company and the way we're starting the
compostability uh side of things with
with the all natural ingredients like
how would you if if you were getting
something like this execute the first 12
months um what's what's the best um plan
of action that you would put into place
is there some reference points some
books you'd recommend me checking out
that really to create the strategy and
work my way backwards uh you hear that
all the time but I I feel like it's
quite a vague uh explanation and uh you
know fundamentally finding where to go
for that or how to create that plan uh
outside of like you know a business plan
I put together the business plan but um
those are all kind of benchmarks and
goals
they they can change month month yeah so
um focusing on what's real and what
actually matters is going to be critical
so number one is profitability at the
end of the day is all that matters okay
so all the Top Line you could be making
a billion dollars and if you're losing
$50 million a year you're losing $50
million a year right so this is the one
thing I'm so glad that I am naive when
it comes to this stuff and that I'm uh
relatively stupid because I remember
this is probably 15 years ago now I
looked at the stock market and I said
this is like trading baseball cards like
unless a stock pays
dividends the stock is worth only as
much as people say it's worth like
there's no intrinsic value to it and I
remember trying to convince people and
they're like oh man you're just naive
like you don't understand no no no like
now that I've been playing the game long
enough I promise you that is exactly
what a stock is if a stock pays
dividends it's real because you get cash
flow out of it and that's based on some
real fundamental metrics in the business
where they have excess cash flow and
they distribute that to the people that
own their shares and therefore you can
actually make your money back while
still retaining the stock and so it
doesn't matter what somebody's willing
to pay for it it only matters what the
fundamentals of the business are but if
it is literally the company doesn't pay
a dividend then if the stock is worth
let's say you know 50 bucks a share if
no one's willing to buy it for me from
me for $50 a share it's not not worth
$50 a share which is why overnight you
can lose so much money in the stock
market because people simply say it's no
longer worth that or then they'll say
it's worth twice that and you just made
a bunch of money but unless you sell it
you have nothing right so you could be
up $10 million one day down $10 million
the next day and like none of it really
matters because until you sell it none
of that's realized so getting people to
understand that Topline revenue is the
same thing right you could be making a
ton of Topline Revenue but if your goal
is to to sustain your company the only
way you can do that is if you get
somebody to invest money in you so we're
living in this super weird time
where essentially the VCS of the world
will invest so much money in something
that has a lot of promise and they use
what's called a portfolio strategy where
they don't need out of 10 companies they
may only need one to be successful so
the other nine you're looking at and
going wait a second they're piling money
into this I don't see how they're ever
going to make their money back they're
probably not and once you realize
they're going to lose that money and
they're just going to make money on the
one company that smashes it and has a
10x return that it makes up for the
other companies and that they're just
okay with that and because they don't
know which one is going to hit I mean
they're doing their best to like figure
it out and base it you know on things
that they've seen historically but
nobody knows right which is how we got
the tech bubble in 2000 it was like
people were just going nuts and I
remember I was super young when that was
happening and I was looking at that
going dude like how are they doing there
was this company called cosmo. comom and
I remember thinking how can they afford
to deliver this stuff cuz they would
deliver things like within an hour like
they would go buy a CD at Target and
bring it to my house for like pennies I
remember thinking what like how are they
doing this and of course they went out
of business because while they had
Topline Revenue they weren't profitable
so Focus your attention on things that
actually matter profitability matters
people could say your company's
worthless if you're making a $100
million a year in profit you're laughing
like you're laughing all the way to the
bank and so nobody gets to tell you
anything because you've got so much
profitable cash flow so focus on that um
also trying to figure out how you should
be spending your time look at where the
bottlenecks are like what are the things
that you're doing that um are taking up
your time what are the things that are
doing that lead directly to sales what
are the things that are that you're
doing that are stopping you from being
profitable like looking at your profit
and loss statement and just finding out
like where are we hemorrhaging cash
right is it payroll is it um our
ingredients are too expensive I mean
there's going to be like in a business
like yours there's going to be stupid
stuff that eats your profitability
there's going to be a drought in
Paraguay where you're buying one of your
ingredients from and that drought causes
the cost of that ingredient to go up and
it makes it harder to get a hold of
you're the small guy so other people are
buying it up so the guy comes to you and
says hey you still want your coffee
grounds you're going to have to pay this
much for it and by the way you're going
to have to sign a contract at that price
for 12 months or 18 months or 24 months
and you're like oh God I got to do it
and so now for the next 18 months your
profitability just got
crushed right what are you what are you
going to do that that's that's about you
know some drought happening so you've
got to be prepared for that stuff you've
got to move from strength to strength
you've got to be looking all the time at
what are those things that are hampering
my profitability and then looking at
your marketing and saying okay like I
love doing let's say you love doing the
videos right oh man I love doing this
content marketing is amazing like it's
my shtick I love it and then you realize
huh it's not actually building my
community so and if it's not building my
community then what's it really doing
and it's taking up a lot of my time so
treating your time like you treat your
money right and expect a return on that
time and so being really honest like we
just made a change to the way that we do
our book reviews and the way that we do
our impact quotes why because our impact
quotes were we know that our long
content dramatically outperforms our
short content and we know that when we
um on YouTube when we marry visuals to
something that that does way better so
our impact quotes even though it was
short content was doing really well so
we're like huh that's weird and the
format of it where I could just riff and
I'm doing it free flow means it takes
very little of my time and then does
really well so what if we put imagery
over that and then the book reviews
which were we were doing on an image
basis but also I had to I had to write
them to make them really concise um and
so it was just like the amount of reward
that we were getting from the book
reviews was very low and the time was
very high the amount of reward we were
getting from the quotes was very high
and the time was very low so what we did
was we basically switched the format so
I could afford to put a little more time
into the quotes make them longer um and
then and make them visual so and I can
Outsource the visual part I don't have
to do that so that we could you know
increase the effect that we're having
there and then in the book reviews I
started doing them free flow which means
they're going to be longer which is good
because our longer content performance
better so anyway you have to be auditing
that stuff you have to be looking at the
results steering by results only results
matter steer by the data steer by the
data that's going to be key all right I
can keep going on in that but we'll
we'll wrap it there of course of course
I appreciate your book reviews I I I'm
listening to the book um uh oh I'm
drawing a blank now here um really
impacting you huh yeah right right right
um I'm natural selection sorry I love
that one yeah it's good it's good okay
um
so I mean putting myself out there and
saying that I have a company that uses
nothing but compostable material that is
definitely putting my back into a corner
in an industry saying hey guys look this
is my lifestyle and um I'm still going
to fall victim to purchasing certain
things I'm still a consumer at the end
of the day uh I'm sure that uh when you
guys were building Quest Nutrition um
one of the thingsi were putting in hey
well we could find a better ingredient
we could find a better ingredient and
there's margins and there's there's
there's um that stuff costs money so
over timeing a better product uh as you
guys develop your better a better
product putting better ingredients into
the into your bars I'm sure you probably
had your back against the wall where
someone was saying hey um why are you
guys using this when you could use this
same for me is like why are you
consuming this when I thought you're all
about compostable product how do you
deal with with uh the conflict and
friction that that could cause Ian that
yes well there is always better things
we can do and and kind of getting called
out um in a spot because I'm I'm sure
that will happen we're some where
that'll that'll that'll face itself and
in in the uh in building this company
and as we build up products like you
know what we're packaging and what we're
using
you know shipping it over um shipping it
across the planet what that does to
emissions and what the box looks like we
put into it like it's all it's all
questions where I'll get i'll get kind
of my back against the wall and I'll
have to answer strategically so what did
you do with Quest when it came to
answering those questions I I wouldn't
be strategic I in fact the one strategy
I would say you should employ is be
super authentic and just tell people
exactly why you're making the choices
that you're making and if it's like dude
for the product to be profitable this is
what we had to do we had to make this
concession um just be open with people
be totally transparent let them know
what you're about uh there will be
people who will hate on you for it and
they will try to burn you down they call
you fake a fraud and all that stuff um
but the people that see that you're
really trying to make the product better
over time that you're trying to bring
cost down for them over time that you
have a profit margin and you're just
willing to live with that like one thing
we did at Quest was we made a way higher
quality product with a smaller margin
and we just said that's the way it's
going to be like we get that and so to
bring this product to people to not be
gouging them um to hit a price point
they'll pay for quite frankly um we're
just going to have to crush our margins
but we're not willing to crush the
quality of the product so understanding
that the the product quality is your
best marketing material ever right so
your product has to work it has to be
something that influencers get they look
at and they say whoa It's got the Almond
oils the essential oils the um you know
the sea salts it's got the high quality
coffee grounds like whatever the things
are that they're really going to
understand that they're really going to
resonate with you you have to make sure
that you have that but then you have to
charge something that gives you a
profitability level that lets you stay
in business so that's the the key is
understanding how um you can make the
product better over time that you're not
trying to gouge the customer that you're
being totally transparent that you're
being authentic that they can see what
you stand for and that if you stand for
compostability 100% natural and that's
going to be the niche that you go after
then you can't ever betray that now that
doesn't mean that there aren't going to
be things um in the process that uh are
less than perfect there will be but if
they see for instance let's say that you
have um somebody that you're working
with to get the coffee grounds and
they're sustainable but you think they
could be doing better if you lay out
like here's our three-year
sustainability plan I'm actually working
with the person that we're sourcing the
coffee grounds on this three-year plan
we're reinvesting money into them now
it's like one that's awesome because
people see that you really care and you
care enough to allocate not only dollars
but time to it and that you're putting
your mental energy into it that you're
sharing it with them they're going to
love that and that's a big thing why do
we make all this content here because we
want to share with people I want to give
away as much as I can for free to
deliver as much value to people as
humanly possible because we're all going
to have an ask right and so for us right
now in Phase One the ask is share please
share so but we're going to try and give
everything away we're inviting people
behind the scenes I believe and to
Jared's point about gen Z I think that
what is going to make gen z um a force
and what's going to change the way that
companies do business is they're going
to demand they're going to demand
transparency and so now they're going to
reward businesses that are run by people
who are authentically in line with what
they care about so the reason that I'm
building a personal brand is I want
people to understand the human being
behind the company and so I want them to
to really know who I am because look in
the amount of cont we put out something
like seven hours or more of content
every week more it's more than that we
put out more than seven hours of content
every week like I can hide somewhat like
I can give you like a a crafted message
for a few hours but at some point it's
like you take it all together and
Aggregate and you just can't hide and so
that that is where the world is moving
that is why um content creation is uh is
going to be more and more and more
important for brands people have to see
who's really behind there they have to
know what you care about I love that no
I love that I think transparency is it's
it's it's fundamental and and it's
exciting because you're putting it all
on the line and uh there's there's no
other way to do business in my personal
opinion so um I know I've been jumping
all over here with questions um it's all
right nobody knows the order you sent to
me in so it's fine time for one more
question all right so we're we're
nearing the end so one more you want to
hand it over to Facebook see if they got
a question yeah sure let's do it couple
quick questions for you so one how long
have you been producing the product and
the other is um do you distribute it
globally so we have some people from the
UK who are interested in getting
nice uh so to answer that question yes
we are going to be Distributing it
globally um we're probably about two
weeks away from that as I mentioned
we're in Kickstarter phase we haven't
actually said hey we're live um that
happens in in an hour and 20 minutes so
um once we do that it's going to be
e-commerce BAS business uh that gives us
Direct Cash Flow so we're able to grow
from that uh I don't have to put any
consumables in in in stores Beauty
Stores um it allows us to keep
everything really tight and the second
first part of that question sorry how
long have you been producing the product
so producing the product I mean as I
mentioned we're in the kickstarter phase
so we haven't uh we've given out samples
we've done some R&D uh I've had a few
hundred people try the product um the
recipes though that are developed for it
uh we're talking about 15 years worth
the experience that those are coming
from so I've sourced out um some third
parties that have really helped me dial
those in uh making sure that we do have
the right balance you know the right
amount of almond oil Shea Butters
coconut butter salt so so the actual U
formulas for it uh those are yeah
there's got to be 15 plus years worth
the experience um I don't want to
release the person's name uh but they've
been helping uh from the get-go on that
there we go all right man well that
brings us to the end thank you so much
for coming on and everybody this is grit
and diamonds you can go to grit and
diamonds.com it is a coffee and salt
body scrub very interesting uh really
really appreciate you taking the time
Jesse uh and again the kickstarter is a
minute or an hour and 20 minutes away
roughly from being done so go check it
out if it's something that you want to
participate in um get yours today so my
friend thank you so much for joining us
thank you for having me I really
appreciate this I will say real quick
here um you know I put a list together
about seven months ago of people I
wanted to meet and believe it or not you
were number two on the list wow um so
not only did I have the opportunity to
meet you I got the opportunity to be in
your studio uh live so I mean part of
you know the phrase grit is just giving
it everything you have and and that's
where that's fundamentally where this
name came from I know it is a greedy
substance but uh I built it off of uh a
characteristic and a personality uh that
that that I believe uh that I hold in
myself so um thanks for this man I
really appreciate it and I look forward
to uh to launching this product and
putting out there for you guys my
pleasure and I have to ask who's number
one oh I know you're gonna ask that uh
Branson I mean who wouldn't want to like
literally go kite surfing with Richard
Branson ah dude I'm with you I think
you've chosen very wisely well man what
an honor to be on the list what an honor
to have you on today really really
appreciate it all right guys be sure to
check it out grit and diamonds.com
really appreciate you guys joining
thanks for asking the questions there at
the end always always awesome to have
the Facebook Community join us really
appreciate it guys if you haven't
already this is a weekly show so be sure
to subscribe and until next time my
friends be legendary take care peace out