Kind: captions
Language: en
people are gonna constantly judge us
whether we go after big dreams or do
nothing we're gonna be judged either way
if we sit on a couch all day our parents
and our friends gonna be you're lazy to
do something with your life if we go
chase after the most audacious dreams we
have a lot of people are gonna attack us
and try to bring us down so we might as
well go do something with our lives and
say thank you for the feedback and move
on everybody and welcome to impact
theory you are here my friends because
you believe that human potential is
nearly limitless but you know that
having potential is not the same as
actually doing something with it so our
goal with this show and company is to
introduce you to the people and ideas
that will help you actually execute on
your dreams all right today's guest went
from being broke broken and living on
her sister's couch to creating one of
the top 100 podcasts in the world
building a seven-figure online business
and being recognized by President Obama
as one of the top 100 entrepreneurs
under 30 in just a few short years
having grown up with a learning
disability being bullied and at eight
years old watching his older brother go
to prison for selling drugs to say that
he started out behind the eight ball
would be an understatement but
thankfully for any of us who have ever
listened to his podcast the school of
greatness his desire to learn was bigger
than his fear of looking stupid and he
lept headlong into learning to use
LinkedIn to meet people he thought could
teach him something he got so good at
this that he not only managed to get
some of the world's greatest minds on
the show a show which by the way now has
more than 30 million downloads but he
also leveraged it to build his
networking techniques into his first
successful online business which he
ultimately sold leveraging that success
he's now running another thriving online
business is a seasoned high-performance
business coach who advises billion
dollar brands as well as being a keynote
speaker who's been on stages all over
the world his first book the school with
greatness
crushed it becoming a New York Times
best seller and details magazine called
him one of the five internet gurus who
can make you rich he's been featured on
Ellen
the New York Times People Forbes
and many other major media outlets and
at this point by any metric he's a
teacher at the school of greatness as
well as its principal student please
help me in welcoming the former
professional football player and to
sport all-american athlete whose latest
book the mask of masculinity is about to
destroy your preconceived notions of
what it means to be a real man the Dean
of the school of greatness himself Lois
House of introductions as always dude so
I'm telling you what you've accomplished
since last we sat across from each other
in the interview scenario is so amazing
that this interview wrote itself I mean
literally all you have to do is quickly
compile the list of never-ending
accomplishments that you've managed to
record but really that's impressive and
I know I know how humble you are and so
I know that you don't do like a lot of
saying this stuff yourself but like
going through and I was like good reward
like it's really impressive
thanks man so well done and I yeah I
love it you start with a vision and you
focus on executable steps yeah I think
it's about the things I do are pretty
simple I just do them over and over
again and I try to find people like
yourself and say how can I add as much
value to your life as possible without
asking for anything in return that's
kind of been my mission is like when I
started out on my sister's couch she was
reaching out to people ask them how it
could help eight years later I'm still
doing the same thing I'm just doing in a
different level it's incredible man I
love that because it really is the story
of intention discipline execution this
is such a simple game but so few people
do it very few so for them to be able to
see what you've accomplished and it's
pretty cool see you know when Ellen was
dope thank you I was really grateful
very blessed you know it was a dream of
mine I remember having a vision of
dancing with Ellen on stage one time
when I was on my sister's couch right
and I told her that in the first
interview I was lucky enough to go on
twice and I told her that in the first
interview and I was just like you know I
like to bring things full circle I like
to have a vision or a dream and then
actually even if it's 10:00
20 years later I like to see it come
true most people I feel like just if it
doesn't happen within the first six
months they're on to something else
right I can be like it's bored out of my
mind doing the same thing over and over
to try to do one thing I think that's
what's helped that's awesome dude and
I'm sure that's what made you great as
an athlete is exactly the same thing as
paying off here and one thing I just
want to put a fine point on and I
obviously have no idea what you guys are
doing behind the scenes but it was very
telling the way that Ellen is
positioning you as like the torch is
being passed the next generation of
high-level entrepreneur or mentor mmm I
thought that was pretty amazing yeah
congratulations for the concern the
works will be interesting it's awesome
yeah wait to see where I go yeah and
then there's the super secret stuff that
you're telling me about before yeah
which when that goes through and I will
use that word during essentially when
die goes through we will have you will
do an impact insider I'll and we'll talk
about it for like 20 minutes and dive
deep in the brain stone of everything
yeah I dig that yeah all right well in
similar fashion let's talk about masks
let's do it so do you think people be
surprised by the top of the book that
you chose absolutely everything I do is
for a reason to you know I try to
constantly do things that put me out of
a box that make me uncomfortable and
that challenge me and talking about
masculine vulnerability definitely as a
challenge you know when I was in high
school going into college my siblings
and I made a bet they all said that I'd
be like this drunk jock football player
because I was going to play oh they're
like you're gonna go and be like a frat
boy and this and that and maybe it's
part of my ego at the time where I was
like I'm gonna prove you wrong mmm I
didn't have a sip of alcohol all four
years of college that's amazing never
even felt tempted because I just made
that in my mind I was like I'm gonna be
different than what people want to put
me in a box to be mmm
you know I've still never been drunk cuz
I just continue to carry that on wow I
was in the school Music Hall
I was in choir I always did things you
know I salsa dance I try to do this
things that you saw sedans well if it's
those names for almost over a decade Wow
yeah over a decade it's a big passion of
mine and I just try to learn constantly
learn things that normally
people that look like me who grew up
like me would never do because I feel
like there's so much richness of life
that I would have missed out on had I
stayed in this athletic jock core group
that you know if I'm generalizing it
just kind of did the same thing and
talked the same way and lived a certain
lifestyle and I just didn't want to live
that life I wanted to live a life of
abundance of learning of constantly
questioning who I am and if I'm doing
things for the greater good or just for
myself and so this topic was really a
self-discovery four years ago I got in a
really big fight I started getting
angrier and angrier in my life as I was
achieving more and more financially
accomplishments Awards all the things
the nice things that you mentioned
beginning is those were happening I
would find myself more and more
triggered emotionally from simple
attacks that people had on me whether it
be like online on social media or
in-person in my relationship I was very
triggered where I would just get more
and more bent out of shape and hurt in
certain situations and frustrated and
resentful and one day at the I was
playing a lot of pickup basketball at
this time it's over six-month period I
was playing a lot of pickup basketball
and I was literally every time I would
go I would get in some type of
altercation usually those extreme verbal
altercations screaming if anyone ever
steps to me on the pick-up courts in the
rough West Hollywood neighborhood Mean
Street streets of West Hollywood you
know if anyone stepped to me it was like
an instant alpha reaction of like
territory like I own this this is my
court don't ever try to talk to me in a
bad way don't try to foul me in the
wrong way and let alone I was doing the
same thing to them so I was like right
but for whatever reason all these things
started coming up more and more and I
was getting more and more aggressive at
the basketball courts in relationships
and then I would take it out in the
courts on like 18 year old kids you know
these kids weren't even that big right
and one day there was a guy who was
actually bigger than me
and older than me and we were going at
it like you know two silverback gorillas
like try to just like get their land you
know I mean and it got down to a really
heated moment where he head-butted me
and it was just like years of built-up
tension came out in that moment where I
you know like superhuman strength came
upon me it's just like rage and anger I
had zero control zero control over my
emotions I allowed my ego my mask to own
me as opposed to having emotional
intelligence and owning the moment mmm
and we got a pretty bad fight and at the
end of it I was just so fired up I
couldn't believe what I did and the
guy's face was just mauled bleeding
everywhere and I was just like what did
I just do what am i what am i doing it
was just like I remember running home
and shame and fear one because the the
police station was right across the
street from these mean streets of West
Hollywood and I was just like what am i
doing like I have everything to lose in
this moment what's why am i allowing
myself to be so frustrated so angry to
fight this guy on a simple basketball
game where there's zero stakes no one's
watching there's no money at stake it's
just my ego at stake and I remember
going home looking in the mirror and
just being like who are you Louis like
who are you but I was trembling I was
trembling I was like what are you doing
and who are you and that was the moment
where I was like I almost needed that
catalyst to be like okay it's time to
reevaluate everything every relationship
my the intimate relationship I was in at
the time relationship with my family
friends everything and the most
important relationship which was with
myself and I was like what is my
relationship with myself I wasn't even
sure what it was was I taking care of
myself emotionally did I know how to
communicate to myself in a way that I
could you know have patience and grace
throughout life's daily challenges or
struggles I didn't have the answers and
for a guy and I know you're a guy who's
constantly seeking for answers seeking
for the truth and can the matrix I
realized I needed the
find my truth in that moment and so it
took me down a path of just
self-discovery taking different
workshops on emotional intelligence
going to different therapists and just
asking questions and doing sessions
wanting to take in as much as I could
from every expert about how I could let
cursed why am I so angry mmm reactive
resentful unforgiving passive-aggressive
why and then how can I move forward so
that it doesn't control me moving in the
rest of my life and that's when this
book research really started to happen
did you already have the the notion of
they were masks or was it no I thought
it was perfect I thought I was like I
had everything figured out you know I
was making good money you know anything
I touched worked you know I was getting
the girls I was making sales I was
getting the accomplishments so for me
everything was like I know the answers
at that moment when I think the ego is
present you're unwilling to look for
different answers or different solutions
because you feel like you already have
them so for me it was really about okay
first being aware my ego is leading the
way how is this supporting me and how is
this hurting me because in some ways it
was benefiting my life I was achieving I
was getting recognition I was making
money I was in good shape in other ways
the most important ways my internal
well-being was suffering was hurting was
confused was depressed at times and was
always in this conflict and so first for
me it was like okay I realize that I
have a challenge I have a problem right
it's that recognition what can I do next
how can I have the understanding the
tools the technology to move forward in
a way that doesn't but I'm not a slave
to my ego but I am aware of it I can
welcome it I can have a conversation
with it and I can let it go and yet for
me it was being aware first and the
second most important thing was learning
to forgive which I didn't think I needed
to do
and forgive the things that have
happened in my life with family
experiences other challenges that I went
through you know all the intimate
relationships I'd been in that I was
still holding on to past pain and then
again forgiving the most important
person which was myself for just
everything that I did or didn't do or
thought or didn't think and just finally
letting go of so many things that I've
been holding on to and when I held on to
these things and didn't have a way to
communicate things to myself or other
people that's when this like this energy
bottled up you want to when men in
general when human beings I should say
in general don't feel like they can
communicate internal challenges arise
and then it comes into physical and out
outward challenges as well and that's
when I started realized wow I've been
wearing a mask throughout my entire life
I've been wearing different types of
masks some phases of my life I'm driven
to just if I'm being blunt here you know
have sex with every girl on the planet
you know my my my masculine brain wants
to be like it's not enough I need to
date more girls or I need to go after
more right at one point I was what now
is my sexual mask at one point I was
like I'm broke and I need to focus on
making as much money as possible and
having you know all the the money in the
world
the watches the jewelry the car is like
all the fanciest things and I was driven
with this material mask which
disconnected me from the rest of reality
I wore the athlete mask throughout most
of my life I had an aggression mask I
have had a know-it-all mask a Joker mask
all these different masks that have
showed up in different times to protect
me from literally just being able to
have a conversation and connect with
other human beings because that was my
biggest fear was letting people see what
I've been through what I've gone through
and the fear of them actually knowing
that I wasn't perfect and I think that
was my biggest fear is what if people
actually knew that I had tons of flaws
would they still accept me would they
still love me when they still listen to
me and be my
friend because growing up I didn't have
friends like you said my brother was in
prison for four and a half years and
being an 8 year old kid in a white
middle-class suburban Ohio
there weren't many other people that I
knew that went to prison right let alone
other siblings of you know peers that I
had so in the neighborhood obviously all
the parents knew that I was the kid who
had the older brother that went to
prison and I wasn't allowed to going
near the kids houses Wow just by
association now so four years I'm
essentially playing in the backyard by
myself just shooting a basketball
kicking a ball throwing a ball against
the wall doing whatever I can to pass
the time and so these things just start
to I think weigh on humans in general
I'm not talking about just men but
humans in general when situations occur
it starts to build up inside of us where
we want to defend ourselves we want to
protect ourselves and we start to just
wear masks and I think that's the
challenge and it's a coping mechanism of
course yeah of coke America and also to
to get to the result of what we're
looking for you know if we're not happy
in a situation if we're not if no girls
will give me attention as a 13 year old
horny boy what am I going to do to like
get the attention and have that
connection and feel like I'm worthy as a
boy trying to become a man you know it
means so it's like we start to fixate on
certain things to get certain results
and I've worn every single mask
I still wear masks but I'm so much more
aware in the moment and I'm quick to
remove at least I try to be quick to
remove because I'm much more aware so I
think that's been key one thing that I
found really important in the book was
the concept and you just mentioned it a
minute ago that there are some times
where the mask serves you which is how
we end up wearing these masks talk to me
a little bit about where is that line
like how do we know when to leverage it
and how do we know not only how do we
know when to stop using it but what
awaits us when we stop using it so the
first part when do we know when to use
it we know when to use it when it can
drive and fuel us to help
achieve our dreams and help create
better relationships so if it fuels us
into achieving our dreams and creating
better relationships put it on as much
as you want when should we take it off
when it's hurting yourself and it's
hurting other people if you're wearing
it and it's not benefiting yourself and
everyone else around you it's time to
take it off it's time to be aware of a
different mass to put on or completely
take it off completely
and be you're vulnerable real self you
know again if you're if you're a young
entrepreneur who's got a startup idea a
product idea you're gonna be very driven
to getting the press get accomplishments
get hit certain marks hit certain
financial goals so that you can you know
live another month and pay your team and
do those do these things so you're gonna
be driven pretty much at all costs to
generate revenue to get attention to get
your product out there maybe burning
some relationships and trying to
leverage too much that's gonna help ask
for too much promotion some things if
it's hurting relationships and it's
hurting your dream it's time to take it
off if it's not for the betterment of
all and it's hurting your health I feel
like it's time to take it off but again
I think if you can do it in a way that
drives your mission forward and leaves
an impact on people around you then cool
but that usually just means being your
authentic self what do you think about
masks in terms of identity because I for
someone like you who spends a lot of
time thinking about this that not only
did you go see a therapist like it
actually registered in your mind that
that would be a helpful thing for a lot
of people that doesn't they actually
don't know what their true self is like
how do they begin to deconstruct and
differentiate between like when you talk
about wearing the athlete mask for so
long in your life and that was real
right they get real passion where you
still do I mean you're on the US
national handball team so it's like
there's there's a point at which it it's
real and sort of core to who you are
when you're being authentic and then it
spills over into a mask how do you help
people deconstruct that process to find
where those marks are I think it's a lot
of self-discovery it's a lot of for me
what worked was having open Commerce
patience and asking for feedback and
when you're wearing a mask you don't
want feedback you want to know that your
rights that your way is the right way
because it's been working for you so
asking someone hey how I show up for you
you know is there anything I do that
just rubs you the wrong way or do you
feel like it's hurting our relationship
or do you feel like I'm disconnected in
any way often did you have conversations
like that growing up not many but four
years ago after this fight I started
having them every day with everyone how
old everyone in my life I think you know
here's something you start with you can
either have an open conversation with
someone and ask them ask them to rate
you you know whatever works for you hey
will you write a list of the things that
you feel like work really well for me my
strengths and my weaknesses or on a
scale of one to ten how open am I to
feedback for you am i you know 9 I'm
pretty open pretty much all the time or
am I about to where anytime you ever
suggest anything I push you away just
start getting feedback from your closest
friends if you have an audience you can
ask your audience and from your families
you ask your audience I didn't
necessarily ask them to like grade me
you know or something like that but I
started having an open dialogue with my
audience I started sharing and revealing
things I started opening up about the
things I was going through things I was
letting go from my past that had really
affected me and kind of having more like
a confessional with being you know with
my my audience of like this is what's
happened to me this is where I'm going
and this is what I'm working on I hope
you'll stick around but I think asking
people to write you a letter you know if
you can't have an open conversation if
you don't feel good about that email
someone and say hey I just want to get
some feedback you know I'm not gonna get
upset
I want you to speak openly to me but
could you write a list of like five
things that I do really well five things
that you feel like are holding me back
and from our relationship from our
relationship with other people and from
my dreams start there you're gonna get
so much and say I want you to be
completely honest again it's just one
person's opinion but it's their
perception and perception is reality to
that person so I try to get as much
feedback as
from my closest friends my family I had
a one-on-one conversation with every
family member I took ownership and
apologized for everything that I'd ever
done and I revealed all the things that
have happened to me that I was
terrifying for them to know hmm
and I started with this question because
I was I was so terrified for my family
and my friends to know actually who I
was things that had happened that I was
ashamed of and guilty of but I started
every conversation and I got this from a
therapist friend of mine because I
didn't know how to communicate correctly
I said is there anything that I could
ever do or say that would make you not
love me so I started every conversation
with that because I wanted to know that
I could be the most messed up person in
the world and I would still have
connection and that someone would still
love me because I think at our core
that's our deepest fear that we're not
going to feel love from someone so for
me I started with my family members they
were all like absolutely not even
especially my brother went to prison he
was like no right away he was like
nothing you know and it was just such a
healing process to say wow I've known
these people for my whole life and yet
they still don't know certain things
about me and I didn't know certain
things about them when I actually opened
up it was horrible when I opened up when
was vulnerable and shared things with
them that no one knew for 25 years of my
life it was like the most powerful
intimate conversation I've ever had with
my closest relatives right and then they
opened up in ways that I just had no
idea what had happened to them so our
relationship formed a stronger bond our
trust and intimacy formed a stronger
bond and I was able to just let go of
things that I was holding on to for
years which allowed me to move forward
so I think it's starting with having
those open conversations if you can't do
that email and ask people to write down
five things that you do well five things
that you can use work on just to get
feedback from people some things are to
land some things on but I think it's
important to get that feedback what
awaits on the other side for the people
that do the work freedom from emotions
freedom from anything that's been
holding you back emotionally freedom
from
mean of yourself forgiveness
inner peace the most powerful feelings
in the world
come on the other side now I'm not
saying that you may not slip back into
frustration and anger and resentment all
these other things like I still have and
work on every month and catch myself but
it's a daily practice to be able to
learn how to take it off when my egos in
the way even this morning I got
frustrated with someone was getting
defensive over text texting back trying
to defend myself and I'm just like what
am i doing you know I'm living in this
conversation about dropping the mass and
yet I'm still wearing a mask right now
because I'm trying to step to this
person who's attacking me or whatever I
felt like was happening and when I said
okay I hear you thank you for your
feedback I can move on as opposed to
having to defend myself you know the
people are going to constantly judge us
whether we go after big dreams or do
nothing we're gonna be judged either way
if we sit on a couch all day our parents
and our friends gonna be you're lazy do
something with your life if we go chase
after the most audacious dreams we have
a lot of people are gonna attack us and
try to bring us down so we might as well
go do something with our lives and say
thank you for the feedback and move on
some things will land other things we'll
just bounce right off and it's our duty
and responsibility to be able to move
forward and and be discerning of the
information we didn't receive have a
close group of people that we really
trust who can cipher some of the
information and give the feedback that
is worthy and then try to learn
apologize move on that's all we can do
one thing on that that I really liked
about the book in the structure of the
book was that so you go through this is
the mask this is some real-life examples
of people that have either worn it or
avoided wearing it and still achieved at
a level that you'd want to achieve and
now what do we do right and in fact
doesn't say like what can we do
immediately yeah so I like that a lot
you talked about you
have a daily practice yeah what does
that look like and maybe give it just
like in the context of one or two
different masks that either are most
frequent for the average person or more
frequent for you if that's easier yeah
you know the structure for me I was like
I need something that's practical and
that simple that I could read myself and
take action on otherwise just writing
about theory doesn't do anything for me
right so at the end of every chapter we
break it down first I acknowledge
someone who's lived with that mask like
a prominent person then I tear myself
down of how I've lived with that mask
give examples so the whole book is
essentially putting me down in a way and
showing all my biggest vulnerabilities
and shortcomings as a man and then at
the end we break down just practical
steps of how you can move forward so one
of these steps could be getting feedback
from people closest to you emailing five
of your closest friends and asking what
are your strengths what are your
weaknesses from their point of view it
doesn't matter you know if they're right
or wrong about something it's just
getting feedback and assessing the
information I really love journaling
journaling for me is a way to express my
own emotions to myself which most men I
would say in general I think the
viewpoint is men aren't able to
communicate their their emotions right
and it starts with being able to do with
ourselves how did I feel today when I
got mad at this person what did it do
for me inside how did I how did that
person feel after that conversation and
are you is that actually what you're
writing down those exact words different
things different problems based on
different mass that give different
prompts yeah but I mean for me it's just
what I've liked evaluating my day like
total stream of consciousness yeah yeah
not worried about grammar punctuation
just whatever just I mean I can't spell
in the first place just like sick so I'm
just like scribbling and I came and read
what I say and do you prefer that it's
handwritten like do you think there's
something more cathartic I think writing
is powerful anyway to get it out you
know use technology to your advantage if
you want to voice it on a voice memo on
your phone do that anyway to communicate
your feelings no one needs to see this
start with yourself
I like having these honest open
conversations more and more like I was
so scared to be vulnerable
prior to four years and now I love like
making people uncomfortable
I mean it's like I love just feeling
like just asking questions that they
would never get asked from a guy who
looks like me you're not I mean and just
going there because why not not why be
surface-level all the time yeah I think
there's a time and a place for
everything but really trying to make
myself feel as uncomfortable as possible
so I'm never uncomfortable and the more
I do the uncomfortable it becomes
comfortable so it's journaling it's
asking for feedback it's it's it's
meditating where I'm just you know in
the morning when I meditate I set my
intention I literally know how powerful
my ego is and that I could be easily
triggered to react like a silverback in
any moment like it's so easy for me to
go to that place if I'm not intentional
about the way I want to be throughout
the day so that's why when I'm
meditating I'm thinking about any
scenario that could happen today with my
girlfriend what if she gets upset at me
for something that I forgot to do how am
I going to respond you know if a team
meeting doesn't go well how am I gonna
respond if someone misses a deadline if
someone does this if sometimes I just
try to go through things how can I
respond if anything happens I might
never react to everyone around me I'm
gonna take ownership so I try to get
clear on my intention for the day and in
any area of my life and when I do that I
feel like I'm prepared I think most
people humans in general aren't as
prepared for these challenges and then
therefore they repeat whether they go
back in to just wearing a mask when any
situation occurs where they feel
attacked let's put on the mask because
that's what feels natural that's a
really interesting point I wanna dive
into that why cuz I so intuitively agree
with you why at that point is the mask
so comforting that's what we're used to
and it protects us like you said is
their structure we don't want to ask is
there like well the mask tells me I
should behave like this so at least I
know what to do I think so it's a way to
protect ourselves to not reveal who we
truly are and when we reveal who we are
we are susceptible for being vulnerable
and
wrong and are the masks do you think are
they created by this idealized notion of
what a real man is yes I think through
our childhood growing up the images
we've seen from our fathers or father
figures from sports heroes icons or
other musicians or business leaders any
of the male icons that we've seen
growing up through our teachers for me
it was a lot of my coaches these were
the the men that taught me through like
the most difficult challenging times for
three hours a day at practice and also
then our peers in the locker room in the
school after-school activities
whenever appear or other boys are
telling you don't fall down don't crawl
don't cry don't show emotion don't be a
you know any type of word we want to use
here don't be a little girl don't be a
whatever maybe all you want to do is be
accepted in this little community of
your peers when you're growing up you
want to be accepted and if you stand up
to the peers your group that you're in
and you're like you know what I'm gonna
rise above this and I am gonna show my
emotions and I'm gonna cry or I am gonna
not bully the other people like you're
bullying them I'm not gonna laugh at
that kid because that doesn't feel good
but when you get outcast for trying to
be a good human being as a seven year
old 12 year old 15 year old from
teammates band mates classmates whatever
you don't want to be alone as a kid
feeling isolated as a child from my mind
is the scariest thing because that leads
to depression which leads to you know
drugs alcohol suicides prison you know I
witnessed this firsthand what it was
like feeling outcast and the thoughts
the conversations I had with myself by
feeling alone going to the principal's
office and every time one in the
principal's office when I would get in
trouble I would say I wish I were dead I
was like I have no friends why am I even
alive I wish I were dead I remember
saying this second grade third grade
fourth grade so for me it's like okay
I need to put on something to be
accepted by people I need to be the
biggest fastest strongest so that I'm
accepted on a sports team I need to be
able to get a girlfriend so that other
guys think I'm cool and they'll hang out
with me I need to be able to make money
so that I can take people out and pay
for their lunch and dinner I need to be
able to be driven enough so that I'm
accepted in society and I think that's
the challenge it's hard to feel like I
have these like morals and ideals and
I'm gonna stand up as a 7 year old boy
and like screw the world this is who I
want what I am what I stand for I don't
care if you don't wanna be my friend I
can do it on my own
like we don't think that way growing up
we want to just feel accepted and loved
and just be a part of the class and I
never felt that way and so I was driven
to be part of my class my team and now I
grew up very loving and supportive but I
also grew up driven with these masks to
try to be even more accepting because I
was afraid to be alone now you talked
about in the book there was a high
school I think she was a high school
teacher right and she did this basically
survey because you were like look if you
think these are outmoded notions of old
that don't apply anymore today let me
show you how present this is more
present now than ever walk us through
what what is it was actually really
interesting even though I felt like I
understand exactly what it means it was
really neat to see it in black and white
here is the traditional view of what a
real man is so walk us through that I
mean I think the traditional view is
that a real man doesn't cry doesn't show
emotion a real man makes a ton of money
because he can provide for his family a
real man is able to have any woman he
wants a real man is strong athletic
physical and a real man doesn't back
down from controversy so I think and
there's there's a number of other in the
list but it's kind of like those key
things a real man is intelligent he can
take on any challenge all these things
and so that's where we get men who are
you know who are stoic who don't show
emotion because you know it was driven
into me day after day
to not show fear to not show a motion on
the football fields driven into you
don't show them that they got to you
right don't let them see you sweat just
like the simple things you hear over and
over but when a coach is beating you
over the head with a whistle screaming
in your face grabbing your facemask
throwing you down and your witness
witnessing this all the time because
you're showing emotion you're not gonna
do it you're just not yeah if you want
to play the game and you want to be you
know achieve your goal you're select
okay I'm gonna be tough like I just
broke my ribs I'm not gonna let anyone
know like you just keep playing you
wanna mean and so it's just challenging
it's just challenging and especially
with boys and locker rooms of sports
teams it's like the conversations so you
know the locker talk is true it happens
unless there's a group of boys that just
stand up or know like hey guys we're not
gonna talk bad about these girls or
about these other kids or about these
guys we're not gonna bully people we're
gonna be supportive it's just rare I
feel like it's just very rare and you
need to have a group of boys who are
educated who were educated by in my
opinion loving powerful women and I was
so grateful that I had two older sisters
and an amazing mother who constantly
would like come back from these dates
like my sisters would come back from
dates and be like never do this Lewis
you know they would like tell me like
this guy's a jerk he was an like
never do this and so I learned early on
like oh you don't treat women this way
and there's a certain way to be in the
world and so I think I was blessed
enough to have kind of that experience
in that relationship with women early on
that taught me how to treat just humans
with respect not women in general but I
mean human beings all humans and that's
what it is I think its first education
and I think women are the most
incredible humans in the world in my
mind and you know why is that a woman
gave me life you know I came out of a
woman and for me it's like I want to be
here without my mom obviously my father
was a part of it too but just the love
and the
ability to give so much love just like
unconditionally I feel like women are
just more wired that way in general
obviously a lot of men are as well but I
feel like that love that support that
softness that sweetness if the world had
more of that support there would be so
much less wars less fighting less
conflict less arguing just with that way
of being in general from you know just
the love that women bring I just feel
like so blessed to have powerful women
in my life that and so that that brings
me to my next question which is what
then do you see should be the new
definition of a real man and is what you
just said included in that like should
guys be aspiring to that where somebody
would say oh I got equal love support
encouragement for men and women I think
it's simple a the definition of
masculinity is living at service being
in service to others and to humanity
we've been given so much just to be on
this earth that's the way I choose to
look at life is I've been given so much
even if I went through so many
challenges I've been given a lot I feel
like it's my responsibility to leave a
legacy by making humanity better and
making the world better in any way that
I possibly can because I was given so
much by just entering the world and
that's the way I choose to look at it so
a masculine man is someone who lives in
service who comes from a place of
win-win of we're all in this together
and someone who lifts others up around
them and what do you so I assume that
you believe in self-love and that that's
very important what should be the basis
of self-love like what things is it what
you were just saying and for Mike you're
looking for the win-win or for me this
is just how I work because it's how my
brain works
I myself at the end of every day I rape
myself and my health my relationships my
business my spirituality I mean
everything I just try to give myself a
rating from 1 to 10 how did that deal
right
and I rate myself a my emotional
well-being where am I at
am i at a 1 or a 10 today that's like my
health I rate it my business how do we
do today in my business my relationships
with my girlfriend in the relationships
in general my spirituality those are the
main things those are the ones yeah okay
if I want to rate myself on like
creativity and play an adventure I can
do that like other ancillary things but
it's usually those four core things and
I give myself a scale you know and where
am i act and that why am i for what
happened today walked because that made
of the four and what would make it a 10
so I just again I'm aware a curiosity do
you put those like if two of them are
conflicting like your business in your
relationship which is from a time
perspective can often be a conflict
where do they fall like if you had make
them hierarchical where would you put my
vision is my main thing in my life and I
feel horrible telling my family and my
girlfriend and my friends that my vision
is my main thing but it doesn't mean
that everything else is not a big
priority sure and that I don't put my
friends my family in my relationship at
a very high level and give them a ton of
time and attention and then present
fully with them with them but for me I
just feel like my vision is the most
important thing and part of that
includes my business part of that
includes my traveling to do work and
every interaction that I have so it's
part of every interaction as well so I
just I'm constantly evaluating based on
those things and I say where am I at
what would make it a 10 what I need to
do it's never gonna be perfect but I
like to scale things and just rate and
evaluate give me feedback I welcome
feedback how can I make it better how
can I improve how can I grow because I
don't feel like if we're just not
getting feedback then we think we know
it all we think we're like already smart
as we need to be and I know I'm never
the smartest person in the room and I
just welcome information and feedback
some things land some things go right
behind me but I'm constantly a demand
for feedback
you know in no way do I have am i this
expert of like masculinity and can teach
it to everyone I just have broken it
down from all the research I've done
with psychiatrists and doctors and
averaged age men and women and
transgenders and drag queens I mean I
interviewed everyone and said what does
it mean to be a man in your mind I just
wanted to get opinions and feedback and
hear people because my way is not the
right way and I just want to make it
simple and easy for men to understand
maybe why they've become who they are
how it supported them how it doesn't
support them and then also there's a
section at the end of every chapter for
women on how they can understand the men
in their lives a little bit better and
how to get them the steps they can take
to get the man to take the mask off
without making them wrong which is the
most important thing when a man feels
like we're wrong I'll speak for myself
and for a lot of friends I know when we
feel like we're wrong for who we are it
doesn't feel good so how can you come
from a place of love and semi
understanding when I know it's really
challenging to do that and in almost
ninja the man's mind and get them to
take it off right like how do you just
like come from a place of such
understanding and love where they just
like oh I don't need this on anymore
like you're not gonna leave me you
accept me you love me
cool I don't need it and that's what it
comes down to most people don't feel
like they're gonna be accepted yeah they
actually really neat by the way that you
put that section in for the women and I
thought that it was very smart and
telling that you walk them through some
of the things that weren't gonna work
like hey let me just give you a couple
triggers they're gonna shut him down he
said this I've been cleaning that mask
to his face and I thought that that was
actually really really useful even if
just like if you're sort of in
silverback grunting mode yeah you could
be like you know pointing at the page
like that's the thing that's yeah
triggering me and making me want to hold
on to that yeah I mean I was writing
this book for myself because I was like
I need this more than anyone right so
let me break it down for four more men
so they can understand what's holding
them back from their truest self and
their greatest dreams
and then as I was writing it and
researching and interviewing all these
people I was like huh I bet more women I
don't want to buy this book and just
understand the men in their lives their
fathers who have been stoic and showed
no emotion their whole life or her get
triggered and mad in any situation their
boyfriends their husbands their you know
their sons I mean so many moms and I've
talked to who are like I don't know how
to get through to my son and it's
struggling they're struggling to just
connect in a loving way there's some
when they turn you know 12 14 18 it's
like there's so much peer pressure and
now I didn't have social media growing
up you didn't either it's like so much
information we're getting of what we
think we're supposed to be or how we're
supposed to act or what we want and so I
was like wow I really need to make sure
I'm writing this as well so that women
could hopefully understand a little bit
more inside of how a guy thinks and
maybe why they act and the steps on how
to get them to to come from a place of
who they are and love as opposed to ego
anger frustrations so we'll see I hope
people like it it makes a lot of sense
and I was gonna say people are going to
like it because it's so useful yes and
insights are incredible and the the
sheer variety of people that you talk
about in the book you directly quote
interview from Dale dye and you would
think that Dale dye and Randy Couture
both who you interview for the book that
they would essentially be saying the
same thing they're so archetypal of the
like alpha male but their messages were
diametrically opposed exactly and so
that was really interesting and then
yeah I mean just obviously you've
collected a lot of amazing people in
your life in the years of doing the show
which is one of the fantasies about
doing this is you meet these incredible
people and then some subset of them
actually stay in your life which is
that's the biggest gift doing a podcast
will ever give you but all of those
people that you've gotten close to make
an appearance and and certainly in the
way that you write about them you can
feel the intimacy and there's just parts
of their life that we otherwise wouldn't
get a glimpse
so guaranteed people are gonna like the
book that's for sure incredibly usable
awesome insights do you worry that some
of the book will be misinterpreted I I
know it will be
a hundred percent my intention was to be
as politically correct as coming from a
good place as possible but I mean just
putting out articles about men and women
in general with so much happening right
now it's just like the amount of
frustration and pain and anger I'm just
like blown away on how the the the anger
that men and women feel about the topic
there's a lot of right and wrong
happening and my mission is for people
to not come from placement right and
wrong because that's what causes a lot
of conflict sure that's what comes talk
in the book it's it's about efficacy
like what works what works and if you
have an opinion and you just shout your
opinion and say you're wrong I'm right
and this is the way it should be
most people aren't gonna listen to that
unless those unless of us you're
speaking to the choir mmm yes you're
gonna rally the troops who believe in
that but if you want to make real change
listen to everyone else who doesn't
believe in that the reason why you know
I believe that Democrats didn't win
because they weren't willing to listen
now I'm not saying there's one party
right or wrong or whatever like I'm not
it's not even about that for me it's
like just be open to listening to
someone else was a completely different
point of view and see where they're
coming from I believe the greatest
leaders in the world know how to
understand where any person is coming
from and can connect and communicate on
their level as opposed to expecting that
person to connect and communicate on the
leaders level very fair and when they
can connect to someone on any level that
they're at that's when you can create
change in my opinion that's when you can
come together that's when you can have
some meaningful conversation and see how
you can work together as opposed to
working apart and that's where I think
as as men and human beings in general
it's our mission to learn how to be an
effective leader in life a leader with
our families with our communities and
with ourselves and if we don't
understand how to communicate properly
and listen
I think the thing that you do extremely
well is you listen to the people that
you interview you listen to your team
you receive feedback maybe you don't
agree with it all but you listen and I
think that is the key to creating real
change creating impact getting people to
take action is by listening and
understanding where they're coming from
as opposed to expecting everyone in the
world to understand where you're coming
from so the last time that we were
together in an interview I asked you
your famous question which is what are
your three truths and you said it's
always hard for me to answer because
it's always changing which I love so I
want to ask it again to see what
different answer we get now because I
feel like since I asked you this
question you have changed a lot yeah so
it'll be really interesting to see okay
since I'm not prepared this is the first
thing is coming off my mind right even
better yeah the first thing is the first
truth is to follow and pursue your
dreams gosh I just feel like what's the
point of life if we don't have a dream
and if we're not in pursuit I don't care
if I ever achieve my dream but I've got
to be in that pursuit because that's why
I learn the most that's where I have the
most amazing times that's where I
explored and venture and travel and
connect with people that I'd never meet
because I'm following my dreams number
one number two would be to take care of
your health we have one body that I'm
aware of the technology we have
available for us today and it's the only
one we get make sure we make sure we're
taking care of it to the highest levels
I'm talking about our mental health
emotional health physical health that
includes being grateful all these other
things that help you live a healthy life
because without health we won't have the
ability to pursue o