Kind: captions
Language: en
the research shows that people should
have some alone time and then sometimes
a collaborator be with other people and
the healthy balance of both is really
important if you're constantly around
other people right the new research
shows that open offices are bad for
human interactions so if you're not
getting your alone time if you're always
hearing and seeing people in the office
you're very distracted but if you're not
getting that and you don't get any human
interaction that extreme can hurt you as
well so men are lonely introverts are
lonely
and then younger people are
lonelier than senior citizens it's
really remarkable and i think it's
partially because of technology because
i think it's hard to be very empathetic
and have a strong connection if you
don't see and hear someone for a long
period of time and people default to
using their devices right and so people
tap their phones over 2600 times a day
they look at their phones every 12
minutes
they're using their phones all hours or
sleeping with their phones which isn't
healthy and so we just have to be really
smart about how we're using this
technology and what i say in the book
and the core
of what i'm trying to get across is use
technology as a bridge to human
interaction don't let it be a barrier to
the very relationships that you need to
survive it's not just about work it's
about survival
[Music]
hey everybody welcome to impact theory
our goal with this show and company is
to introduce you to the people and ideas
that will help you actually execute on
your dreams
all right today's guest is a new york
times best-selling author and one of the
most absurdly prolific writers of our
time by the numbers this guy is
absolutely off the charts he's written
over 6 000 articles that have been read
by over 10 million people he's
interviewed 2 000 people from forbes
magazine alone published over 40
groundbreaking research studies and
surveyed over 90 000 people from 20
different countries he's been featured
in over 1200 media outlets given some
2000 interviews himself created the
largest aggregator of workplace research
in the world and his personal branding
blog is the most syndicated career
resource in america his book promote
yourself was also named the number one
career book of 2013 by the chicago
tribune and his book me 2.0 was named
the number one career book of 2009 by
the new york post he currently writes
for or has previously written for some
of the most prestigious publications on
the planet including time harvard
business review the wall street journal
fast company the world economic forum
and businessweek to name but a few his
avalanche of bonafides is far too long
to list but he's no stranger to best of
lists he's been on ink magazines 30
under 30 business insiders 40 under 40
and businessweek's 20 entrepreneurs you
should follow
so please help me in welcoming the man
who has been cited in over 50 books the
best-selling author of back to human how
great leaders create connection in the
age of isolation
dan shawbal
[Applause]
what's up brother how you doing so happy
to be here
so happy to have you man
and
the place that i want to start is with
fulfillment you kicked your book off
with that which i thought was awesome
it's one of my absolute favorite topics
to talk about because i think it's so
important
you even take the time to define it in
the book so define that for people and
why did you start the book there i
started the book with focus on
fulfillment because it's really
making sure that you are personally
professionally fulfilled in all aspects
of your life that you feel very grounded
that you feel very proud of yourself and
once you are fulfilled you can be a role
model to other people
you can help steer them in the right
direction whether that's with your
leadership or just in their own careers
and but if you don't have yourself
straight if you don't know your values
if you don't know your purpose if you
don't really know where you want to go
then they're not going to be able to
come with you and they're going to be
stuck in their own careers so focus on
yourself first
and then when you figure yourself out
you can then meet with them and really
understand what they're looking to do in
their career and how you can best
support them so fulfillment is personal
and professional it's everything that
you hold dear in your heart
so you brought up values let's talk
about that do you see it as a process of
discovery do you see it as a process of
definition a bit of both like what does
that look like i think through life
you experience many different things so
the best way to figure out what you want
to do in your life and to figure out
what your values are is to have many
experiences for me i was very fortunate
because when i was 13 i had my first job
i was
a caterer at my local temple in newton
massachusetts and through that
experience i got to learn the most
important skill which is being able to
manage and work with other people
it's why eq will always become more
important in our world is because if you
understand how to work with other people
you not only learn how to manage and
lead but you learn a lot about yourself
and how you operate and how you can
relate to yourself and understand your
place in the world and so for me
by knowing that you start to understand
okay what's most important to me what do
i stand for well for me i want to be a
resource for other people i want to add
value to people's lives i value
intelligence i value thoughtfulness
which i think is is extremely important
i think the smartest people are the most
thoughtful the ones who are thinking
about every little thing the people who
are putting the all that work into
understanding who you are what you
represent and being able to
relate and connect with you on that
human level like you do with reading
because you read everyone's book before
you have them on you have a better sense
of who they are you can relate to them
you can ask the right questions and form
stronger bonds and that is so important
and yet a lot of people are not willing
to put that level of effort in into
really understanding who they are what
they represent and what the other person
wants so that they can deliver for them
so i find that this is a big sticking
point point for people and one of the
things that i get hit up on all the time
is what that process looks like so
how do you begin to break that down so
you gave us a couple examples there of
questions that you can ask yourself but
did you journal this stuff like how did
you begin to identify those things that
you value and then maybe even more
importantly how did you pick the ones
you were gonna put your stamp on and say
like they've crossed some sort of
critical threshold of
not just i care about it or not just
that i value it but that i value it
enough that it becomes one of this
subset of things that i care about that
i'm really going to invest in
self-awareness is a huge part of this do
you think you can develop self-awareness
i think that we need to spend a lot more
time with ourselves
in order to be able to invest and
support other people at the highest
levels so if you spend time with
yourself you start asking yourself the
big questions so one of the questions
that i've recently asked myself is what
really motivates me now and what
motivated me in the in the past so what
motivated me in the past i call it i
call it the dark side of motivation i
think that everyone has a light and a
dark side so dark side is i need an
enormous amount of validation in my 20s
to cover up for
my uh you know teenage years of being
bullied not non-stop by you know
teachers and friends and just about
everyone besides my parents you know
your parents can tell you how great you
are but once you go out into the real
world and you start getting made fun of
i had a teacher in elementary school
that put me in a closet in middle school
i was put in a locker that's why i
always related just to screech and say
by the bell because he was put in a
locker and so
i needed so much validation and now i
don't feel like i i don't have that dark
side of motivation i have more of the
light side which is
just doing the right thing by other
people i'm taken care of i feel
validated i feel very fulfilled so now
as a leader i can offer so much more
because i know myself i've taken the
time to really think through why i am
the way i am throughout my whole life
all these experiences that i've had you
know growing up just always working with
people who are older than me and
understanding and asking them what's
important to them and how they formulate
relationships when they're older and
they have fewer close relationships so
that to me is feedback saying okay if i
know when i'm 60 70 80 i'm going to have
fewer relationships who do i want to be
friends with and invest in now knowing
that's inevitable in the future and so
taking that time to think about who i'm
connecting to who i'm bringing my life
who i don't want in my life and making
these hard choices is so important yet i
find especially with people my age
everyone is not only looking for
validation
but
they are afraid they have true fear to
leave a relationship because they don't
want to be lonely they have fear of
being judged so they just stay online
and are always on their phone right so
it's it's there's so much out there and
in order to cut through the clutter you
need to understand yourself so you can
invest the right time and the right
people and the right opportunities and
within an organization
once you know yourself not only can you
lead people because people will want to
come with you on your journey
but
people are more likely to work harder
for you and stay with you longer because
it costs so much money to replace
employees that if you created a culture
where people feel like they're part of a
family there's a sense of belongingness
which is one of the employee
engagement factors that i cover in the
book
people are more likely to work hard
establish friends in the workplace stay
with you longer and outperform and
that's what you really want i want to go
back to your screechers which
researching you that came up
quite frequently the being bullied the
creation of the anxiety which is
something i have also struggled with not
the bullying but definitely the anxiety
and
i want to know how you didn't end up in
a death spiral from that like that it
obviously is gnarly if you've got a
teacher putting you in a closet that's
crazy town and then to have your own
peers putting you in a locker most
people i think that really damages their
psyche their sense of self self-esteem
all of it like it it really gets gnarly
for them how are you able to to stay
positive to because you really end up
going on to buck against what other
people are telling you you can't do
and you don't have a problem being the
lone wolf
how do you stay positive through all
that i think
part of being a lone wolf was being an
only child
but i didn't know i had anxiety when i
was younger i was never told that
it runs to my family and so i had i only
figured that out in the past five years
and i'm 35.
so it's it's now into this journey of
understanding
what being anxious means and and what's
really fascinating is now i've
psychoanalyzed my life i'm like okay why
do i eat fast
why do i respond to emails so quick
it's not random it's because
i have anxiety and so the anxiety much
like technology that i talk about in
back to human is a double-edged sword
so technology can bring you closer
together it can make you more human it
can create more opportunities for you as
you've also experienced
because i was really
early into personal branding how to use
social media to build it and that has
done incredible things for me but at the
same time if we're always overusing and
misusing this technology it can bring us
further apart and damage our
relationships anxiety can be a
superpower we both like you know comic
books and so it can actually supercharge
your career because it's like oh my god
like i got to get this done i got to get
that done it's that feeling that that
anxious feeling that you actually have
to do more and more and more and more
but you have to be careful on that
because that could drive you to insanity
and create more pressure which is bad
for your health
awareness of a problem i think is the
first step in solving it and then it's
about thinking about okay
where is it maybe damaging me and where
is it maybe helping me and maybe i can
take that superpower that energy and
direct it into something that's going to
be really powerful and i had a few
friends growing up that recognized this
in me and i remember when i was nine
years old i was crying into my pillow
and i was like okay
you know i don't fit in i'll never fit
in
but the butt is the most important thing
but maybe it's because i'm special and
someday i'll do something great so the
butt saved me psychologically and then
it was you know this long decade
um in my 20s of trying to validate me so
all the achievements all the interviews
all of that of course i was trying to do
the right thing and support people
but i needed i needed the dark side of
motivation to push me through to achieve
excellence at that point and now i don't
need it because i have all the
validation i feel very fulfilled in my
life but i think if you really look at
it the anxiety
set me up to being bullied at some
respect because people want to bully
people who are not only different but
are suffering people want to pray on the
weak sadly and i don't think that will
change in 50 100 years but it's good to
be aware of this so we can we cannot
start to do something about it and
and then realizing that the anxiety
could actually supercharge my career and
recognizing that and then now in this in
my 30s recognizing that if i don't
control it it will it could really hurt
me and so
learning how to control it and
manipulate it for a good cause i think
is really important how do you think
about the narrative that you tell
yourself
and i asked that because i've got to
imagine as you slip into the identity of
i'm the victim that getting out from
under that becomes really hard but
you're super analytical so i'm wondering
if at some point you realize okay wait i
have this narrative it's a narrative
that's at least to some degree not
serving me and did you actively begin
telling a different narrative like how
did that work i think the best
change in the narrative happened when my
first book came out i was 25 years old
every book has been rejected by every
publisher besides one
the first book came out and my mom gave
it to my kindergarten teacher and
kindergarten was i was always in trouble
and my mom always likes to tell a story
about when she gave it to my
kindergarten teacher who in her head was
like oh
he'll not never amount to anything
because he was always in trouble she
started crying and she was just like so
thankful and so happy that i was able to
do that and to me that
the old version of me the old story was
that was never good enough i was always
in trouble
maybe i wasn't going to amount to
anything
and and so just even hearing that story
when parents wouldn't even let me
play with their children because i had
such a bad reputation not because i was
a bad person because my actions made me
be perceived as someone that they
shouldn't have their kids around because
maybe i'll rub off on them
and so everything has played out from
worst reputation to let's say one of the
better reputations of where i grew up
and so that story has played out in my
head and it makes me feel very proud of
what i've been able to do um and so now
in my thought process i'm but i'm you
know more of a little bit more of a
veteran now and more thoughtful and
deliberate about what i want to do
and it's less about the recognition it's
less about the validation it's less
about that the old stories i used to
tell myself because i've gotten past
that so here's what's really fascinating
is i've gotten past that and so not
having the dark side of motivation in a
sense has demotivated me a little bit
the dark side actually pushes you to
work harder so i've been thinking about
now if maybe the dark side isn't as bad
as we make it out to be and as long as
it's controlled and we're conscious of
it
yeah i'll agree with that nice and
violently um i i think that that's
really really under
it's it's misunderstood so people can
get in a dark loop and it takes them to
somewhere absolutely horrific but when
you
balance it not equally but i'll call it
an 80 20 split roughly right so 20 of
your time in the darkness 80 of the time
and the light the beauty the wonderful
things you're grateful for the you know
beautiful things you're trying to create
and bringing to the world but
even just looking at your list of
accomplishments it's crazy dude so when
i think about that that was partly
driven by that like hey i need this um
to prove to myself that i'm worthy like
it
actually ended up in something pretty
extraordinary and one thing i want to
understand because you have some like
for a guy that talks about connection
and workplace fulfillment
work life integration
when i hear
how you came up in your first company
with what you did with the marketing
plans i thought that was pretty
extraordinary walk people through like
how you get ahead like what does that
look like because you've got a pretty
profound story
yeah so my first job was with emc umc
dell now a multi-billion dollar company
and when i was working there i was in
the marketing department i was a nobody
it was my first job out of school i was
like how do i get ahead and so
the senior director of marketing was
like okay everyone has to do a marketing
plan in my in my department and i was
like oh my god like i've done marketing
plans for many companies during college
i'm gonna
do everyone's marketing plan or at least
get them started so i went around and i
did everyone's marketing plans so when
they were leaving uh work early i was
still working i was working and you know
all day all night just to do everyone's
marketing plan and what happens when you
add that much value to so many people
who don't want to do that job
they'll love you it's the best job
security you ever get and then that
advances you further because when they
get new work when they get new things
and i love doing marketing plans too so
it's not like i hated it
but i actually a lot of people i've
interviewed say if you do the work that
other people don't want to do and work
that you might not even want to do you
get ahead
because you stand up so i think it's you
work as hard as you can have as many
experiences as early in life as possible
and it prepares you for the rest of your
life and the other thing that i've
always thought of is like
for you even doing this video or or
anything you've ever done in your career
when you are 70 you still have a video
clip
right so i even posted today a clip of
me 10 years ago speaking to one of the
original audiences of school in an
auditorium talking about how one summer
in high school my first internship i
made a thousand cold calls selling phone
auditing services
made no money for the company i didn't
like it i was sitting next to customer
service everyone was chain smoking so it
was depressing but i learned a lot about
myself the importance of sales and that
companies require it and that i wanted
to figure out how to sell myself in a
new way because this was not how i was
going to eventually build a business and
that's part of how i got so good at
publicity it's interesting when you were
talking the most fascinating thing that
you said was that you learned a lot
about yourself doing those thousand cold
calls even though they weren't effective
and i think to really understand
dan shaw bell we're gonna have to really
dive into this self-awareness thing i
need to know like how much of that can
be turned into process i know some
people think that you either have
self-awareness or you don't
i am a massive cheerleader for it can be
developed but i want to know if you have
any insights from a process perspective
because right now people are listening
to this and if they're really paying
attention to your story dude it's insane
what you've done
and
it
is those moments of oh i learned a lot
about myself there and and what i know
means is that translates into strategy
that you shift you learn something new
like in that case the pr thing but what
is your process for developing
self-awareness and if you can package
that from that time that would be really
helpful yeah i think part of it is you
take notice of what people say about
your work so a lot of people back in my
early career were like oh wow dan this
marketing flyer that you develop is
really good so in my head i'm like oh
maybe i am really good at this because
you don't know how good it is unless you
get that feedback that's why you know
when you're giving feedback to your team
and you say hey what you did or the idea
you came up with in the meeting is so
great that validates them so now they
have more courage to
give you the next idea and they and it
validates their way of thinking of
saying oh my god like maybe i'm good at
strategy and coming up with ideas simple
as that for me
the more feedback i got the more i
realize what i'm good at and what i'm
not good at so did you strategically
seek out feedback i strategically did as
much as i could let me develop this
marketing piece let me do cold calling
let me do all these different things
because i don't know any better
so when i am performing these actions
and getting this feedback it tells me
what i'm good at and where i should put
more of my energy to and where i should
divert my energy
so i think that's really important is is
knowing not only what you're good at and
what you like but what you don't like
and so look for models get feedback
and then really really think about
what's gone right what's gone wrong
almost do a self-assessment pretend you
are a company in a sense and do a real
analysis of where you are what's worked
what's not worked what you've liked what
you haven't liked do you have people
right what excites you i think you
absolutely have to write it down right
because when you write it down you
internalize it more do you just sort of
flow style journal or do you go okay
here are the things that i know like
known personality traits or known likes
known dislikes do you have things that
you break it out like that yeah so i i
write down values i write down goals i
do is i break it out into a year and
then i have future goals and then i have
what i'm what i need to do within a
quarter within a month uh within a week
i don't go past a week and i don't i
don't really go too far past a year
because things change so fast and then i
take stock of what's working what's not
working where i'm getting business
results what you know i'm writing this
down i'm saying okay you know my
business partner said this about me
customers are liking this so it changes
how i sell what i work on uh and where i
spend time with and the real thing i do
in terms of energy i like the word
energy a lot because
if something's working you should put
more of your energy across that i'm not
going to keep on going against the wall
and hurting myself right so if i know
that's not working then i need to switch
strategies and focus on something else
that works if i want to continue to do
what i want to do and move forward or i
just stop it all together so i think
that for me it a lot of this is trial
and error if i really examine my life
what has it been it's been trial and
error and trial and error allows you to
gain self awareness and get to know
yourself and i think you can break it
down and write down what turns you on
what turns you off what you like what
you don't like based on the
conversations you have it's the human
element that is so important you know if
you only spend time alone it's going to
decrease your your creativity actually
you're going to not be as thoughtful
about your life and come up with new
ideas
i've we've done research that shows that
people are most creative in
conversations with other people people
make you more creative
not sitting and looking at a wall not
looking at your computer all day or your
device it's being around people it's
those brainstorm sessions that you have
where you get the best ideas because if
someone brings something up another one
of your teammates can be like oh i like
that but have you thought of this
and that creates the conversation that
helps everyone and i think in terms of
self-awareness
self-awareness is not just doing work on
yourself and really figuring yourself
out but it's also understanding yourself
in the world you live in in in your set
in your home in your community in the
world right as you travel and speak
around the world it's it's coming to
grips with who you are based on putting
yourself out there in an authentic way
collecting the feedback writing the
feedback down internalizing it and then
investing in areas that will bring out
all of your best qualities
all right so i think you may have a
superpower in this area and i want to
know how much is just sort of that's how
you are and how much is you've really
developed it and can help other people
do it so i keep hearing stories where um
you
do this massively powerful thing where
it's you take something negative and you
find a way to learn and grow from it
rather than be destroyed by it so how
have you gone how do you get stuffed in
a locker how do you get told it's never
going to be successful how do you get
rejected dude the number of publishers
that rejected you even after your best
seller is is crazy so you clearly have
some mechanism by which you either i
didn't even get into my college an early
decision that i applied
i interviewed on campus i wrote them a
letter i got straight a's you know my
last semester my internship at reebok
took me a year and a half i had to like
meet someone who knew someone in the
company because only the executive sons
and daughters got the internships it's
that's the through line my whole career
is is at first you don't succeed try try
again so how do you deal with that
though as a as a narrative about
yourself like how are you not going
this can't be this hard for everybody
and which of course would be
self-defeating and then you get in this
negative loop how do you stay positive
so i know you learn the early butt right
so um i don't fit in i'm an outcast but
maybe that means i'm special and i'm
meant for something great okay is that
is that it like every time you encounter
that like it's really hard for me but
maybe that means i'm special and i'm in
for something great
the mentality has changed slightly now
now it's i've done all of this
everything else is just a bonus but
that's only because i've accomplished a
lot so when you were in that struggle
period was it always that phrase that
you came back to over and over like i
meant
i needed a model a model means i had to
go through it at least once so let's say
getting into college i struggled to get
into the college of my choice but i got
in and then the the reebok it took me a
year and a half but i got in emc when i
wanted that job i it took me eight
months but i got in and i always try and
find a way in and every time i do that
it reiterates okay things are not going
to be easy but you will eventually get
what you seek
right and so with all the rejections and
everything in every area there's been so
many rejections but it gets me through
it because i see models i've tried
enough things that have worked that it
serves as a model of me and an example
of what's possible i believe
learn that yourself or do you go find a
model that you've seen work somewhere
else and and start from there i do a lot
of research of course like i'm always
looking and seeing okay this person
they're an author but they're a speaker
like how they
build their lifestyle to reflect what
they enjoy
and i take something from everyone but i
always at the end of the day have to do
something that feels unique to me
right so if i post on social media it
has to be original if it's a quote from
someone it has to be part of an
interview i've done it has to feel
unique to me and the more the more you
live the more you grow the more you fall
into who you are actually are
so people don't change they become more
of who they are so keep doubling down on
yourself and by by believing yourself
and being authentic and putting yourself
out there what really happens is not
only do you become the best version of
yourself hopefully but you'll attract
the right people in your life who like
you for you if you continue to copy
other people or try and be someone
you're not or live up to society's
expectations your family's expectations
you lose sight of who you are and you
end up falling in with the wrong crowd
that doesn't appreciate you for you
because you aren't even you to them
talk to me about productivity this is an
area where i feel like you really have
some powerful ultra usable insights how
can people be more productive and maybe
on the tail of that because these felt
kind of related to me in the book
productivity and creativity um how do
people be more of both
yeah so i've talked to a lot of people
about creativity and in order to change
your mind and open yourself up a few
things need to happen one you've got to
change your environment so for me it's
walking meetings it's working in
different places traveling to different
countries that opens me up it makes me
see things different
you know both of us we've interviewed so
many people so we we're
you know we're able to uh think
differently uh you know have people who
might have conflicting opinions which
makes us smarter and sharper and more
open
so i think that it's
who you're with
having people around you who challenge
your beliefs it makes you smarter and
sharper and changing your environment i
think that's the core of creativity in
terms of productivity the first the most
important thing is the night before
you're planning out the next day
the worst thing that happens is when you
wake up and you're like what do i do now
you do not want to do that so construct
your day so it reflects what you want to
get out of it so i believe in work life
integration it's you have let's say
three pers one to three personal one to
three professional goals and on a daily
basis and then you look at your calendar
and you build in those activities that
are going to let you accomplish those
goals the problem that people have is
they look at their calendar it only
reflects their professional life not
their personal life
so if you are if you want to go bowling
or to a movie with a friend put that in
the calendar if you want to have lunch
with your business partner put in the
calendars because people view their
calendar and they say this this is my
life i live and die by the calendar if
it's on the calendar doesn't exist so
the calendar has to
represent what's going to make you
fulfilled
so all this stuff is connected i'll have
you know research goal i got to do five
studies at least a year i'll have a
speaking goal i want to do at least 10
speaking ages of the year i want to have
a travel goal and so i to have a driver
goal is very easy all you have to do is
before the next year starts you book a
trip like i just i'm going to cuba that
was booked last year so that once you
put money down on something it's a it's
a sign of commitment and it locks you in
for actually accomplishing the goal for
the next year and so it's understanding
your own psychology and then putting
together a work schedule a personal
activity schedule that best reflects
what's going to make you fulfilled and
being honest about that not just doing
well for the sake of doing it the
problem in our culture is it's a burnout
culture people are working more hours
especially with technology people are
working nights weekends on vacations not
having your phone is the new vacation
right because there's a guilt feeling
there's convenience feeling and
addiction
and so you need to realize that and you
need to have time set apart for things
that matter to you and so true
productivity is on an individual basis
and if you waste too much time doing
things that are not giving you the
benefits just because it's a distraction
or fun
that could hurt you and you shouldn't be
complaining if you do that so it's it's
getting to know yourself that's why
fulfillment's important it's the
self-awareness and then it's putting
together schedule to reflect what you
want to get out of your day week month
quarter year
dude listening to you talk like the
subtext is what's fascinating and i
really hope that people use this
interview as a jumping off point to go
way way way into your world it is so
interesting to me the way that you
approach things and what what would you
say to somebody who hits a roadblock
their attitude is woe is me things are
against me
and if you look at the situation it's
like yeah things really are against you
what do you tell them
i think that you need to stop for a
second and look at all the positive
things right because you need to get it
yourself out of the negative mode if
you're thinking negative it's going to
be very hard for you to step into a new
environment whether it's a new job or a
relationship and make that work because
you'll bring that negativity you won't
have the self-confidence to make it work
so it's about being grateful and
thoughtful about everything you have
done and being self-aware of what's
worked what's what hasn't worked and
then the most important thing and this
has gotten me out of depression it's
really helped me because the last book
was rejected by all the publishers and
it was ruthless and it put me i was
depressed for four days and it sounds
like only four days but like shut the no
lights nothing complete blackout we
didn't want to talk to anyone and the
way i got past that
was
small steps before big leaps you know
small wins digs you out of big ditches
meaning that
well i wasn't going to have a book deal
in the next few weeks but what could i
do to at least give me more validation
self-confidence i wrote one article got
that published wrote a second article
got that published and then i started to
get a little bit more traction and
excitement for what i was doing again
and then i hit up my agent i was like
okay i'm gonna i'm gonna redo the book
proposal for the fourth time and a
proposal is like 50 pages at least right
and so it's a small little wins that
give you the confidence to put yourself
out there so if you're looking to get a
new job why not do something small first
to give yourself
yourself more confidence so in the
interview you have a better success rate
so that one
small thing you can do is maybe a
freelance gig maybe do someone a favor
something small
and then bit by bit by bit by bit you
gain the confidence and you're
showcasing your skills and maybe that
person you did the favor for wants to
hire you just don't know how that plays
out
but the most important thing is those
small wins add up
and give you the confidence make you
more positive and then when you have to
interview when you have to talk to
someone maybe ask you know grow a guy
out you're going to perform better
so instead of trying to take this big
leap do the small steps
that's amazing
i'd be super remiss not to talk about
loneliness um after reading back to
human one of the things that you talk
about like the that it's actually
costing governments money because of the
ailments for lack of a better word that
it brings out in people one just give us
a brief overview of the pandemic that is
loneliness which is actually really
interesting and then
anybody watching this that's in that
place like what do people look out for
and how do they get out of it yeah so i
spoke to the former u.s surgeon general
and he said that loneliness is an
epidemic in the united states and abroad
and that
loneliness has the same health risk and
reduction of lifespan of smoking 15
cigarettes a day that's crazy so it is
crazy and then in america half of
americans are lonely 40 percent lack
meaningful relationships younger people
are actually more lonely than senior
citizens
in the uk it's really bad they had a
minister of loneliness because
loneliness is costing in terms of
productivity companies in the uk over
2.6
billion pounds
9 million people are lonely over 200 000
adults haven't spoken to a close friend
or relative in the past month
it's just a major problem in japan
twenty thousand people die of loneliness
every year
so it's it's a global problem
uh we lack community sadly and i think
that if we want to bring each other
closer together if we want to prevent
loneliness because the people who are
the loneliest or will suffer the most
are men these are less emotional they
have they have weaker bonds because of
that the less vulnerable which will
hopefully change with lewis howes and
many of our other peers who are you know
focused on that
i think
ending loneliness is tough but doing
something about it is essential to us
living a healthy and fulfilling life and
how do you do that it's you
put the energy in to harness the
relationships you currently have
parents siblings friends take stock of
what you have it's like customers right
it's easier to serve customers you
already have serve the customers you
currently have you know make them less
lonely and as a return you'll be less
lonely i think one of the the tough
things and the reason why we have such a
loneliness epidemic too is because a
third of the global workforce works
remote
and i think working world's great i work
remote but because of that i personally
have to figure out how to get the human
touch because i know it's important
clearly
so i think the social engagement's
important and the research shows that
people should have some alone time and
then sometimes a collaborator be with
other people and the healthy balance of
both is really important if you're
constantly around other people right the
new research shows that open offices are
bad for human interactions so if you're
not getting your alone time if you're
always hearing
and seeing people in the office you're
very distracted
but if you're not getting that and you
don't get any human interaction that
extreme can hurt you as well so it's a
healthy balance it's gonna be a little
bit different from everyone like if
you're an introvert you probably need a
little bit less
so men are lonely introverts are lonely
and then younger people are
lonelier than senior citizens it's
really remarkable and i think it's
partially because of technology because
i think it's hard to be very empathetic
and have a strong connection if you
don't see and hear someone for a long
period of time and people default to
using their devices right and so people
tap their phones over 2600 times a day
they look at their phones every 12
minutes
they're using their phones all hours or
sleeping with their phones which isn't
healthy and so we just have to be really
smart about how we're using this
technology and what i say in the book
and the core
of what i'm trying to get across is use
technology as a bridge to human
interaction don't let it be a barrier to
the very relationships that you need to
survive it's not just about work it's
about survival so i make a huge case for
work friendships
because seven percent of the global
workforce has zero funds at work and
half have five or fewer yet we're
spending so much time at work the
average work week in the us is 47 hours
a week
and
using the technology that expands it we
have work creep into our nights and
weekends and so if you don't like the
people you work with if you don't have a
leader you can trust there's no sense of
belonging if you don't feel like a
family like this feels
you're gonna be detached and it's gonna
you're not gonna be able to grow
business if you're so busy replacing
employees all the time
so we need to start to think about that
of creating a really healthy environment
for our teams and then from a personal
standpoint it's about taking ownership
of your calendar it's about thinking
about who you want to be friends with
forever who you want to support forever
no man it's so important the area that
you're dealing in and i
as somebody who has now been in the
entrepreneur game long enough to watch
millennials really come into the
workforce
um
it's it's been really interesting to see
the change from my generation which is
gen x
you know growing up in the 80s with the
you know the
the hype around work yourself
essentially to death
and then to see the shift happen and to
see a new attitude and the death of the
autocratic leader and coming into
something that's much more collaborative
yeah transformational leaders for sure
and seeing the
the birth of like purpose and meaning
which unfortunately in the beginning of
my career that wasn't a thing right so
um i didn't have a model to use use your
words and so
that led me to living the cliche of
money can't buy happiness and and then
having to fight my way out of that
so it's it's really been fascinating to
to see the changes and
um yeah so hopefully you know i'm hoping
that this generation like you said when
technology becomes a tool and not the
barrier that we're able to present so
many more ideas that people can get the
model that they can hopefully avoid some
of the traps but i think what you lay
out for people is just absolutely
critical about how to avoid the traps
before i ask my last question tell these
guys where they can dive into your
insanely rich world online
yeah dan shawbell.com so it's
s-c-h-a-w-b-e-l
cool
final question what is the impact that
you want to have on the world
i want the world to
take the time to experience as much as
they can to be thoughtful about their
interactions
to come from a positive place of giving
even if
there's some
dark motivation try and turn it light as
soon as you can and think about when all
said and done the impact that you
personally want to have in the world and
use the content the role models the
models that you have in front of you to
think about how you can achieve that for
yourself because once you achieve this
for yourself
you are going to be a role model for
other people and it creates that cycle
of helpfulness the cycle of impact the
cycle of everyone becoming better
together
i love that man
guys all right i'm telling you on this
one as you dive into his world you're
going to see something that gets bigger
with every
like page you turn every book you
encounter every interview he's done
every article he's written it really
really is astonishing and he's got this
laundry list of accomplishments because
he's really done things that are worthy
of celebration and watching him grow
with the people that he's trying to
service is really pretty extraordinary
and you see the truth of what he says is
his mission to go with his generation
from
being the you know the student all the
way to being the ceo and it's it's
really really fascinating because he
makes it so tactical and reading the
books and seeing that he has scripts and
seeing that there's actual language
questions to ask yourself interactions
to have with other people it's really
phenomenal and it's clearly somebody
that is using data is researching this
stuff is putting things forward not just
this sort of
hypothesis but is really saying we're
doing the research and here's what the
data is showing and letting that guide
where he goes and the way that he
approaches problems so often it's very
counter-intuitive but when you read it
it just makes sense and because he's
growing as his audience grows you really
get a overarching tool kit that's going
to allow you to go in any direction that
you want and i will say as somebody
who's actually slightly out of his
demographic i still found it all
insanely useful and so i don't think
that by any means it speaks to anything
more than really the title of his book
which is back to human which is
something that we can all tap into and
all relate
i think it's incredibly powerful man i
will aggressively put a stamp of
approval i think as you go down that
rabbit hole you're going to find just a
countless treasure trove of things that
you can immediately put to use in your
life so
check it out all right if you haven't
already my friends be sure to subscribe
and by the way if this added value
please do share it that means the world
to me and it helps us reach more people
and have bigger impact and you know
that's what i'm driven by all right
until next time my friends be legendary
take care
if you like that episode and you want
some more amazing content on mindfulness
and connection be sure to click the link
below to see the j shetty interview
enjoy and i'll see you guys there
look at yourself in 10 15 20 years time
and ask yourself the question
is that where i want to be and if the
answer is no then you need to find a new
part