Kind: captions
Language: en
After my biggest loss in my life, which
is losing my son with 18 years old,
I was confused for a while, about three
or four [music] years in a dark,
thinking about suicidal, thinking about
drugs, thinking about, you know, [music]
what's the purpose of life? And I
realized with Hawk's departure, we may
never not have tomorrow. Tomorrow may
never happen. Hey everybody, welcome to
another episode of Impact Theory. Today
I am joined by a living legend. This
man's life is so extraordinary, the one,
the only, Master Hixon Gracie.
Thank you, Tom.
Thank you so much for being here, dude.
I read your book cover to cover. I was
blown away. I watched the documentary
Choke. I knew who you were before I read
your book and before I saw the
documentary, but this was performance on
a level. The note I took was this is a
person who's actually made use of his
full potential. It is really
extraordinary what you've accomplished
in jiu-jitsu.
Thank you.
I mean, the Gracie name at this point is
synonymous with jiu-jitsu.
Yes.
Uh in large part thanks to just your
unbelievable accomplishments.
We'll get into some of the specifics for
sure as we go, but there was one moment
in the documentary that defined for me
why you're so different than everyone
I've ever met. And that is you're you
were in a championship fight, but the
way that it was was it was rounds back
to back or fights back to back. So, you
would beat one opponent, then you'd get
paired with another opponent. And so,
you and this other guy each had, I
think, two full fights before you met.
Yeah.
And he had been punched in the face so
many times.
Yes. that he couldn't see. And in the
locker room, somebody in your corner
said, "You've got to punch him." And do
you remember what you said?
Yes. Said, "I don't want I don't want
it, and I don't need to hurt him to win
the fight." Because I felt compelling
based on he's a warrior. He's a tough
guy. He's lighter. He previous fight
against a a Dutch guy who was very mean
and and and and dirty and poke his
finger poke his eye with the finger and
uh he was hurt and he won this fight
after about a battle of 30 minutes or 40
minutes fight and then he fought another
big wrestler who's also and then he end
up in the finals with me. was a
eight-man tournament
and my part my my training partners my
my my people say oh you have to kill
this guy punch him said I don't I don't
have to be violent on this guy because
I'm not intimidated by him the
opportunities based on striking so I
will be gentle because I believe I'm
tech I'm more technical than him
and I can win so that's what I did and
this was a very interesting because
Japanese are very particular and
observing details, moral details,
personality, ego, you know, brutality.
And after that match, the the press
recognized my my kindness
and uh and the spirit of the true
samurai, which was not exactly
overpower, you know, you just do what
you have to do in a loyal and and and
and nice battle. Yeah, that was the
thing that I found so interesting in
your whole journey and even when you ask
your brothers and cousins like what are
the things that made you so special? You
hear that idea of spirituality a lot
like he really understood his body. He
understood like the transcendent nature
of the fight and seeing that the the
honor of that and that for you fighting
seemed to be connected to something
else. How do you conceptualize fighting?
Because there were times where I mean
you've said many times, I am prepared to
die, literally die in this fight. Yes.
So, how does the same guy that's
prepared to die to protect his honor
say I don't have to be violent to win
this fight?
Yes. Because for me, I was never
prepared myself to be a fighter.
I was not seeking for elements to win an
opponent. I was representing jujitsu,
you know. I was not seeking for learning
box or learning elements to just be
prepared with all the in all the corners
to to defeat my opponent and I event to
make money or so. I was there to fight
for free to represent the art to just
acknowledge the fact what I've been
practices
the weaker one in a fight to give
possibilities. So I was focused on
representing the family, representing
the the style.
With this being said,
you you pick just a fight. But if you
get any achievement, if you want to buy
a car, if you want to buy get a
girlfriend, if you want to uh buy a
house, if you want to get a new job,
whatever endeavor you focus on
is somehow a challenge, somehow a
battle, somehow
you have to use martial arts. You have
to use the the ability to because
martial arts give you tools.
The tools are connection
base,
deflection,
strategy, emotional control, the
capacity for you to to over to
visualization
and other elements. So
if you want to buy a car, you have to
use a strategy the same way you use to
to to to win a fight. You have to see
how much you have to put in the car or
everything else after that. So basically
in order for you to achieve happiness,
you have to be
strategically correct. You have to be
capable to control emotions. You have to
be focused. You have to be perseverance.
Nothing coming easy or for free.
So, and happiness is always changing.
What make you happy today 10 years from
now is it's not going to be the same
thing. You're going to be have different
goals, different expectations.
So, in order for you to really feel
happy,
you have to be present. You have to have
a goal. My goal always been representing
my family and that's make me happy to go
in a challenge situation to represent my
family to be able to to bring everything
I got in a positive mission in my in my
You said that being born a Gracie put a
lot of expectations on you. You fought
in no holds barred tournaments which is
important for people to understand. you
fought where people would show up at
your training facility to challenge you
and and show up to hurt you.
Yes.
And how with all that expectation, with
so much physically riding on the line in
so many of these fights, how did you
control your mind? Like how do you get
control of the field?
Yes. I think I think what's crucial for
me was the the deep understanding.
All my practice, all my talent, all my
physicality is not going to be enough.
All my thinking, all my emotional
control, all my strategy is not going to
be enough,
all my surrender, all my capacity to
accept death
is not going to be enough if they come
in long separate. I think we have to in
order for us to grow as a spiritual
warriors no matter if it's physical or
just theoretical your growth to
facilitate your life to conquer things
to be happy you have to have a good
unified body in terms of body mind
spirit
you have to understand your physicality
you have to understand your mind you
have to understand your spirituality
because Those three things combined make
you feel powerful.
How I could engage in a fight, a serious
fight like that with no time limits, no
weight division, no no rules basically,
no mount piece, no no cups, no. So you
basically go for a unpredictable
situation.
How I could go just by betraying with a
guy 60 70 pounds heavier than me. So
just being prepared, just being talent
is not enough.
Just be able to focus and be
strategically correct is not enough. I
have to have the spirituality to say
today is a great day to be in a battle.
If I have to part to depart today from
another from a different uh different
dimension, I will be grateful to get
here that far. So I was accepting death
in order to be comfortable in hell
because how a fireman can leave home
disregarding the possibility he can be
the last day because he can be and try
to save a kid in a building and die. How
a police officer can leave home without
knowing the possibilities he may have to
get shot.
If you don't realistically believe on
those possibilities, you should not be a
police officer. You should not be a
fireman. You should not be a fighter
like myself in that kind of perspective
of unpredictability.
Being an athlete, being a sport like a
judo or MMA, which has rules, has time
limits, has weight divisions, those are
pretty much predictable.
Is a is a sport. It's a very
interesting, a very brutal, a very
contact, a very aggressive sport, but
it's still a sport. Martial arts
transcends that because martial arts, I
have to feed my students with
unpredictable situations for them to
start to realize they have a chance when
everything is go dark, when everything
goes like if I have a knife against you.
So, I don't know what to do. So, pay
attention K just put your hand here. So
I start to build up confidence. I start
to build up situations where the guy
will feel I supposed to be dead here but
I have a chance. I So building that
windows of opportunity, windows of
chances. I've been creating myself as a
confident and possibilities.
So I'm not go there to lose or to
compete. I go there to to preach or to
do what I know and be sure I going to
win. So in my mind was no defeat was no
was just victory and that's it because I
believe what I do is perfect. Now, what
makes that so interesting is that I know
at um I think you were 14ish, you were
in a fight. You the you had kneed the
guy in the face and you said he just
spit his teeth out and was still ready
to fight and you were like that was so
troubling to you that at round break you
were like I don't want to go back in and
your dad pushed you.
Yeah, that's was my first professional
fight. I was 19 years old. The guy was
30 something. Oh,
he has 120 fights
and four draws. So, 120 victories and
four draws. You know, he was never being
defeated.
Wow.
And my father pul me to I was crazy
about representing and he kind of
received a call from the the manager of
the this other guy and he set up a I
said, "No, I'm sorry. I don't have
nobody to fight." And then I said, "Dad,
please pull me in. Pull me in. Pull me
in." And I said, "I have a kid here, 19
years old." And the and the manager
said, "No, master. This guy is
professional. He's a very tough guy."
And as the guy tried to take my my my
father out of the deal, my father got
excited because he felt like, "Oh, I
going to have to put this kid to prove
himself. But he's good. He can handle."
So, he set up a fight with me with this
guy. His name is Zulu. And uh and I was
there to fight the guy.
And he have a trademark move which comes
like he starts and then he block himself
to get don't get punched. He get close
to you, put one hand between your legs
and lift you and throw you back on the
floor like it's like a a move he always
does.
As he approached that, I was quick move
myself back and hit him with my knee
with the best heat I could ever possibly
think. And in my mind,
I said I win the fight for sure. was a
knockout and after that he just shook
his hand speed a tooth and ready to for
more I said wow so that's take me out of
my comfortable zone in terms of nothing
is what I expect
right
and the fight goes on for the because it
was 10 minutes rounds unlimited number
of rounds so so when the first round
stops ends I was dead tired full of his
blood and I was crawling to my my core
corner and I said, "Dad, there's no way
I cannot go back there." And my dad not
even listened to me. He says, "Oh,
you're doing great. You know, he's worse
than you. Now you're going to kick his
ass and this and that." Said, "Dad, I'm
serious. I'm just dead here. I cannot
go." And I start to argue with my dad
and and my brothers throw me a bucket of
ice and and water in my head.
And then the the the round bang bangs
like bells again and I went to the fight
and like my dad said
I beat the guy in three minutes because
he was already tired. I could get a good
position and choke him out.
And I I noticed my worst enemy at that
point was my own mind playing tricks on
me. Tell me I I don't have enough. Tell
me I was tired. tell me I going to lost.
So my mind was completely against my
purpose and I felt like I could not let
this happen ever.
So after that fight I make a
a a statement in my spiritual in my
mind. I said I'm not going to quit
anymore. I have I prefer to die than
think I have to quit.
So since then I already creating a
element of I'm going with 100% and if if
I fail trying so be it but it's no
quitting is no expectations there's no
oh that's got harder and stuff so based
on that I bring myself mentally to a
next level was a was a obstacle which to
jump that obstacle
I have to see life different after that
and
were there things that you could do to
cement that so that you knew that you
would actually rise to that in the
moment.
Yeah. Visualization
because in the warrior arsenal we have
different tools.
We have physical tools like talent,
mobility, strength, coordination,
techniques, leverage, angles, timing.
But if you're talking about mind, we
have different tools. visualization,
emotional control.
In the spiritual side, we have hope, we
have faith, we have patience.
Those elements, they give you chance of
of letting the situation cook in a in a
slow burn and see how goes. Because if
you impatient, if you don't have the
hope, if you don't if you not believe in
yourself, sometimes you get caught in
the middle of the of your chores without
you know what what but if you faith,
you're going to find the light. You're
going to find the hole. You're going to
you have the hope things going to do
well. So you become smoother even in the
bumpy rides. So I start to feel like my
growth was depending of this growth. Not
only physical, not only mental, but also
spiritual.
Yeah, I find this warrior spirit,
cultivating the mind, getting yourself
to a place where you've rehearsed like
if I'm in this situation, this is what
I'm prepared to do. I'm going to go all
the way. I I'm utterly intoxicated by
it. Like I find this
[sighs and gasps]
when I think about what does it mean to
be a man? That's part of it for me. Like
just that you it doesn't have to be
fighting, but it does need to be that
warrior spirit that there's something
that you're so committed to that you'll
go all the way. In the book, you talk
about a moment where this really got put
to the test. The all of this stuff
together, Hixon, it it almost seems
impossible to believe that it's one
person, but the time that I think it was
a Japanese fighter shows up at your um
school
and fish hooks you.
Yes.
Walk us through that story because in
the book you detail it so well and I was
like, "Oh my god."
Yes. Uh the situation was after I become
successful in Japan and the in the MMA
scenario
professional wrestler in Japan is big is
huge. But professional wrestlers they
have fighting backgrounds. They they
coming from judo wrestling catch catch
striking box. So they tough fighters but
they fix fights.
and I was invited to fight under their
arena and I said in the magazine I could
not ever fight the champions and stuff
even though the rules are good because
they supposed to be fake fixed fights
and and doesn't give me legitimacy. So
winning or losing there has no plays no
role on my realistic view.
And I said that and I said I I'm welcome
to bring those fighters to the to to the
real arena which has rules which are for
real
and I hear nothing.
And then a couple of months later,
the number one guy was challenged me
before changed the scenario for the
number two guy, which was mean bad guy,
like the the villain of the the whole
scenario, you know, one of the big
villains of the wrestling world. And he
say, I I want to go to to Los Angeles.
I'm going to kick your ass. I going to
beat you.
And my friends, Japanese friends come
tell me, "Oh, Anjo said he coming to
fight. You ain't going to say." And I
could not say nothing about because I'm
not sure if he's coming.
I'm not sure when he's coming. So, I
keep living my life naturally as nothing
happened because I could not be prepared
for I don't know when or what.
Eventually, one day I was sleeping in my
house because I don't teach the morning
classes, the the very early morning
classes. So about 10:00 my my instructor
called me
and said Hixon we have a a a couple here
wants to talk to you some Japanese guys
and immediately I imagine the fight the
fighter was there to fight me said okay
I'll be right there and I was with my my
like pajamas and stuff
and I get into a car my son was going
with me so I give the camera for him for
start to become familiar with the camera
and I start to tap in my hands before I
get on the freeway, you know, to get
there ready to fight.
And I get there, my academy was in the
alley. So soon I get into the alley, I
saw a a van full of Japanese reporters
with cameras and stuff. You see a crew,
a filming crew in there.
And then I get I pull in, I get there
was a couple, a very tall guy, Mr.
Gracie, how are you? I said, oh, how are
you doing, sir? Very very well dressed.
I'm president of the UFO, the the
federation there. And I wonder because I
want to invite you to fight in Japan. I
said, man, I told you this before. I
don't want to fight in Japan for you
guys. Yeah, but you also mentioned you
could fight for free [laughter] if the
guy coming to you said, "Yes, and I come
here because I expect you to be the
fighter." Said, "Yeah, but the fighter
is outside." And then I realized the
fight was outside with the crew.
Can I pick him up? Can I call him? I
said yes. So as the guy approached going
out to pick up the fighter,
this is like out of a movie.
I said to one of my students, which is
also a bouncer and said, "Man, stay on
the door. Please let the guy the
president come in. Let the fighter come
in, but keep the press all out. Don't
let the guys come in."
And that's been said. The guy come in,
the fighter come in
and then the guy was all kind of looking
ugly like look of everybody like this.
And I said,
"Uh, Limo, Lio is my instructor." Said,
"Limmon, get a waiver for Mr. Sign the
waiver." Because if somebody gets hurt,
it's just a waiver to be signed here.
US. And then Lim give it to him. The the
waiver. The guy look at the waiver like
this. And then the president called me
and said, "Mr. Gracie,
that means if you don't sign the waiver,
you're not gonna fight."
Immediately I felt like a double trick
that because if I say no, he has to
sign.
He could leave and tell I'm scared, I'm
afraid or I was quitting, whatever.
Said, "No, no, no. Forget the waiver.
Throw the waiver out. He coming to
fight.
Come over, let's fight, man."
And then the the fight begins.
And I felt he was his approach was he
want to hit me hard on the face. You
know his his base the way he's
positioned himself comes more towards
the striking mode than actually
grappling.
And based on that I I kind of play
myself a little dummy for him to
approach. When he go for the punch I
deflected, grab him under the waist,
leave throw him on the floor mounted and
I start to beat him up.
Uh but in my mind different than a
regular competition
was not about defeating the guy and make
him tap because if I make a clean
victory [clears throat] and make him
tap, he can stand up and say nothing
happened. He's a
So I have to show
physically the damage. So my intention
is not just put him to sleep or squeeze
his arm. was just punching him in the
face. And after some punches and break
his nose and make him very bloody, he
turns back and I choke him out and put
him to sleep. And then as he's sleeping
face down on the ground, I stood up and
tell the press could come in. So the
press start to come in and take pictures
of everything. and the president of the
his his his friend tried to cover his
face to don't show he's all bloody and
stuff
and then uh
the guy said to him gay no get out let's
clean his so shows his face on the so
and then two days after this guy coming
to my place with a samurai helmet and
offer to me as a gift show was a lack of
respect for him and He's apologizing and
he was
you know feel like I was honorable and
and and
gracious on on defeating so he was
giving me a gift and left.
Did you live ready to fight at all times
at that period in your life?
Yes. Yes. Was no time for preparing was
just be in shape all the time be ready
to fight any time because that's all
that's the only thing I could do.
Yeah. That's what I think makes your
family and your style of fighting,
certainly in the era where you were the
number one, so interesting, is that it's
born out of being ready for a street
fight. It's born out of really being
able to defend yourself in a life or
death situation, not just in the sport.
How were you raised? Your dad seems to
be a very unique character. Yes.
What what values did he instill in you
guys?
My father was a very special guy because
he was very weak when he born.
He learned jiujitsu
long before his practicing jiujitsu
because he was forbidden by doctors to
practice a sport. He could not run a
bike or run play soccer because he has
verticals. He pass out.
He was very tense
and very weak physically.
and he was learned from my uncle his
older brother
and uh but he could not practice. So
when my uncle opened his school on the
1925 in Rio de Janeiro, my father was
sitting on the corner for about three
years just watching my my uncle teach
different moves. So he memorized
everything. He knows everything just by
photograph
and he not exactly fighting because he
was forbidden. So in one day he's 16
years old
uh a student come by come come by and my
uncle was not arrived yet. So he said
for the students, "Mister, if you want
to practice a little bit, I can play
dummy for you. I I can just be sparring
for for a little while until my brother
arrives." Said, "Oh, I love to do that,
kid. Let's do." So my dad engaged with
the guy start to practice and stuff.
Half hour later, my uncle arrives and
the student said to my uncle said,
"Clos, if you don't mind, I love to keep
training with your with your younger
brother because he's so talent. He's so
good. I love him."
And that's my dad engaged himself in the
practice. But different than normal
persons, the choke for example was done
choking somebody using the arms. He
could not do one pull up. He could not
do one push-up. So he's weak. So instead
using power from the arms,
he develop
power from the chest which comes much
more leverage and is minimizing the the
real muscle effort and gives more
strength on the leverage of the the
action. So he start to adapting himself
for the jiujitsu he learned
and we compare Elio Gracie to jujitsu as
Einstein to physics. He was an inventor.
He creates things to to modify things to
adapt for himself. And that's why
jujitsu gets once arrives in Brazil this
kind of special element of more
techniques or more softness or more
capability to adjust
especially fighting from the bottom
which my father could not ever fight
from the top. So he developed ways from
the guard position which he has opponent
between the legs to be able to not only
be comfortable against punches and to
also submit with triangle chokes, arm
bars and and strikes. So he becomes very
clever on that aspect of fighting.
So with this being said, my dad grow as
a general as a
as a new modern view for jiujitsu and
make not only the his kids but his his
nephews
parts of a clan. My uncle Carlos always
been a very dedicated to create a clan
and my my my father was the guy who was
the the the the general
for the army. You know he was more
physical. He was more giving talents and
my uncle has more the spiritual guidance
giving more nutrition values for the
family giving more sense of strategy for
the accomplishment. So he was the guy
behind
with his mind open for everything and my
father was the guy who's really bringing
the fight bringing the the techniques to
the cousins and the family. So when I
born my father was already on his 50s.
So I could not have the experience of
him fighting.
I could not remember those elements. I
remember him more older
giving my brothers thanks for improving
my jiujitsu or or guidance students or
talking about the federation talking
about the politics behind. So I get from
him the the impression was he's the guy
who leads all of us to a better future
to a better representation to grow the
family.
Did he push you guys to be tough or
anything like what were his you know
push? He's very strong on morals, you
know. He's very strong on I don't want
you guys fight each other. So, whoever
is wrong. Too many men's in the house.
So, whatever is wrong is better
apologize.
Because if you not apologize when you're
wrong and you guys fight for that, when
I discover who is making the mistake,
this guy will pay triple.
So, it's better you guys arranged. So, I
was feeling confident to argue. My
brother get the apple I was about to get
said give me the apple I was so I saw no
no so I gonna talk with my dad because
you're wrong the guy said okay kid take
this [laughter]
because he keeps like a moral values he
keeps honesty he keeps you know if you
talk the truth no matter what you're not
going to get punished if you lie you get
three times more more punishment than
you're supposed to have so you did you
who breaks this said I break that so
don't do this again that's pretty much
it was not big punishments because I
tell the truth if I lie was be worse you
know will be different punishment so we
very early understand how important is
to be honest the valuable the integrity
the capacity for you because a lot of
what I learned from fighting was in the
dinner table seeing my dad talking about
resilience about you know elements he
passed on fight. So I was getting that
kind of information and applying on my
own life.
Do you think that being small and weak
influence the way that he thought about
things like resilience?
100%.
His possibilities he has to develop
possibilities outside of the physical.
Fight is physical.
Fight is brutal. Fight is violent. How a
guy who is not physical can be fighter.
He has to use strategy, techniques,
leverage, angles,
you know, and that's bring a completely
different dimension. It's
so interesting that he took to that so
well that he could just watch it and
then be able to do it instantly and then
be able to innovate. It's uh it's really
pretty impressive.
Yes.
Now, is he unique like that or have
there been other people that have added
He was just genu. He's just a special
character who he not only devote himself
fully to jiujitsu passionately. He's
very passionate about but he has the
coordination and the talents. Sometimes
he spend eight months without going to
the sidewalk.
He's spending on the gym eating,
sleeping on the gym, waking up,
training, sleep
without going to the the beach, without
going to the the bar or the nothing. is
just spend eating on the school. So it's
unbelievable how much passion and
dedication.
Yeah, it's interesting like that. So
there's a quote, I forget who said it,
Aristotle or somebody that the only
impossible job is raising kids. And one
thing I know you've talked a lot about
is when you're coaching or being a
parent that you have to first assess
what that person is like, what they need
and then give that to them. Where did
that insight come from?
Yes. One time I was start to eating to
helping my brother to teach as a a dummy
for him. So he put me lay down Hickson
John mount. So I was playing the dummy
for the student practice the whatever
they So I was there and he gave me a
little tip in the end of the class for
me to buy ice cream whatever. So I start
to making little money
from my brother
and I got my dad and said, "Dad, what I
should do to be the best teacher?"
He said, "If you want to be a good
teacher, you learn the choke, you learn
the arm lock with precision, with
details, and then pass through the
student and ask him to get tight here or
there." So give him the details of the
technique. If you want to be an
excellent teacher, you have to capture
what the students needs to learn.
So with that advice, he gave me the
sense. So I cannot be just a jujitsu
teacher. I had to be a psychologist too
because I have to approach a guy who's
tense, insecure in a different way than
approach a guy who's just lazy and
completely off.
So the whole tone of the class, the
whole inspiration, the whole talking
proc thought t thought process has to be
different from one to another. I cannot
teach a girl as I teach a boy. I cannot
their inspirations are different. So
based on that sense, I start to realize
jiujitsu has a lot to do with the
mindset, with the approach because we
all need to learn
something from martial arts. But
sometimes you're not aggressive. You're
not mean. You're not a competitor.
That's doesn't mean you need you don't
need to learn martial arts. Martial arts
is not exactly just to win. So mindset
is something you and I were talking
about before we started rolling as being
a common denominator among people that
are successful. What elements other than
emotional control, which you've already
talked about, resilience, we've talked
about, but what elements of do people
need to be successful of mindset?
my developments, my mental, spiritual
and physical developments,
they could reach a plateau
if I was not involved with breathing the
way I am.
It's very interesting but
the only organs [snorts] are capable to
give and receive informations are the
brain and the heart.
Other other than that the body just
works
but doesn't have influence. If you get a
a bad email you immediately going to get
upset. You're going to get
claustrophobic. You can get emotional.
You can get, you know, depressed
because your brain tell you you don't
you're not happy. Sometimes you feel
something but doesn't hit your brain.
Hit your heart and immediately you feel
emotional, you feel sad, you feel
whatever because you felt in your heart.
The lungs
are the only organ who are capable to
have a connection, a direct connection
with your brain and with your heart.
When I start to training breathing,
I start to felt a completely different
dimension of death and my sensibility
and my capacity to feel myself deeply
because normally in average people born,
people get slapped on the butt, start to
cry and then they feel like they know
how to breathe, they can survive and
then they learn soccer, they learn
fighting, they learn baseball, they
learn sports, surf, and they live based
on the same breath doing things.
But the the real learning of your
breathing system is to learn how to
maximize your ventilation or
hyperventilation
to cope with the activities you plan to
do.
The the the perfect breathing system
give you hyperventilation.
Give you capacity for you to relax and
sleeping mode. Give you capacity to be
sprinting for longer. Not only for one
breath take. So whatever you need from
your body even from your spiritual
guidance you have to drive by a perfect
breathing system. The breathing allowed
you to find yourself deep into the this
your system.
What's the thing in your career that
you're most proud of?
Oh man,
it's hard to say because was just a a
continuous mode of successful elements.
I'm undefeated. I have 400 over 450
fights.
Jesus.
I never I never win anyone by sub by by
points. I always submit or knock out.
So my career is very successful from
even for my retirement.
Maybe the most thing I'm proud of was
after my biggest loss in my life which
is losing my son with 18 years old.
I was confused for a while about three
or four years in a dark not feeling
appetite for training for surfing.
Nothing really appeals to me. I was
putting a lot of time on my garden on my
hillside just meditating and thinking
kind of little depressed
and but I allowed myself to to to get
deep in the dark you know I allowed
myself to hug a stone and go to the lake
and stay deep on the thinking about
suicidal thinking about drugs thinking
about you know what's the purpose of
life being a very much weak in the
purpose you know crying and not feeling
like no that's okay I'm strong because
if you try to hide emotions from
yourself and try to show everybody
you're okay you're just making a patch
which is not working so I have to feel
like weak and and and and completely
vulnerable and then I get there
and in order for me to get out of this
this hole
one day I was meditating in a little uh
platform I did on top of the trees for
my son and I was there and I thought
about my dad and my dad always say in
everything bad happens to you is always
a good side of it and everything good
happens to you is always a bad side of
it so nothing can be only bad or only
good
and I start thinking about what could be
good based on my my son's departure
and I realized
Time for me was always something I was
in charge about it. I could fight at
will. I could teach at will. I could I
raised my kids. I could my dad I want to
talk to you. Okay. Not today. I going to
surf. Tomorrow we talk. I was able to in
be in charge of my time and my will
freely.
And I realized with Hawko's departure,
we may never not have tomorrow. Tomorrow
may never happen.
And I start to understand how important
for me was appreciation of today.
Our conversation today is the most
important thing for me now. Nothing can
be
better than this
for my attention, for my focus, for my
passion, for for the audience, for you.
I want to be present here. I want to be
fully. So when this is over, I will
think about what's next.
So being present make you make a big
difference. And thinking about my son,
thinking about
that, I give you a glimpse of how I
change. If I going for a fight in Japan
now and I'm in the freeway
or a seminar or something, a show or
something and my daughter call me, "Dad,
I need to talk to you." I said, "What's
happened, sweetheart?" Yeah, because she
start to cry. I will stop my car in the
freeway,
talk to her, try to resolve the problem,
get into the depth of the situation
because whatever I have to say, how
longer it takes, I will be there for
her. And after I turn it off, I will see
if I still able to get the flight, if my
trip has to be cancelled, if whatever is
going to happen after, I will deal with.
But I'm not going to say swe I go to
Japan, I call you from there. Bye. I
never will do this anymore.
So my appreciation for time becomes
different and I'm grateful for Hawk on
departure because now he gives me a
completely different perspective of how
I should live my life and how I
appreciate my time and how much I kind
of tight the knots for not getting loose
gaps and and and be just
not concerned about things that matter.
Today my day is based on what I can do
best to make my best day today. I have
to walk the dog. I have to do things
which are I feel complete if I do what I
have to do. If I leave my dog without I
will feel like wow man I let him down.
So I want to do my best day.
No matter if he's walking the dog, no
matter if he's helping somebody to to to
go to Costco to to make
bite stuff, no matter if I have to fix
my my roof, whatever I have to do, I'm
focused and and grateful and and help
and happy about it
and my way. So the appreciation for that
those elements coming from my
understanding and maybe was maybe the
biggest change, the biggest
progressive positive move I did in my
life since I know myself
was exactly that kind of positive change
and then after I understood that I think
about Hawk I'm happy I thinking about my
possibilities I'm happy and inspire with
the moves I do through through jujitsu
through my federation through my so my
life changed because what was my biggest
loss becomes my biggest sign of how I
should do to have a happy life.
It was really heartbreaking reading in
the book about that. I didn't realize
that you had lost your son. When you
think about that, like the spirit of,
you know, a kid growing up in your
family and how hard they have to fight,
how do you like rein them in? You have a
really interesting philosophy about how
much you can guide and then at some
point you have to let them be them. How
do you do that when you know like that
it you know tomorrow isn't guaranteed?
Like that seems so difficult.
Yes, my father has 10 kids.
So
not all are champions. Not all are
fighters. We all involve in jiujitsu.
But in the sense of education we we
bringing they bring jiujitsu to my
attention. They bring the sport jiujitsu
to my attention. They bring the
philosophy of martial arts to my
attention. And I could be a doctor. I
could be a a police officer. I could be
other things was but it was as
underneath pressure which you grace
you're supposed to be a fighter. So I
know what my direction was but I have to
recruit my my courage my desire my
sacrifice which a lot of members of the
family doesn't doesn't feel like oh man
too much training today I hurt myself.
I'm not going to go back there next day.
So it's a different elements to
to combine the experience I have was the
information I get with the dedication
and the and the and the compromise I put
myself in. So it's is a dual thing.
Nobody could make me what I am if I was
not a focus and passionate about it. So
my dad com make his put his part on it
but also I put my part on it my
commitment.
One example is I was 12 years old.
I was very uh orange belt practicing in
a group class with adults. They they
have fun with me. They not hurt me or
anything. So I was there playing and
then one time I fly to a strong man, not
tough guy but just tough, just strong
and he get me in a headlock and
headlocks technically are not exactly to
make you tap. It's a position who is
very uncomfortable but you can resist. I
was tired. I was a kid. The guy was very
strong and I tap and I get so upset
because it was claustrophobic. It was
not about the pain or the the
submission. was about the the agony and
I get panicking and I tap and I was
upset. I cry a little bit. The guy said,
"What's you okay, kid?" "No, I'm okay.
Thank you." And I went home with that in
my mind. And I get home in in Rio de
Janeiro, like summertime, 120° humid.
It's like unbelievable.
I lay down myself in a carpet almost
like that. I lay down myself on the
corner of the the carpet like this. And
I tell my brother Halls to roll me up
like a bito
and just take me off here in 10 minutes.
Leave me 10 minutes here for me to to
get claustrophobic in this feeling. So I
was enrolling the carpet all dark
smelling bad get claustrophobic at first
and then eventually I start thinking
about the beach the seagulls the wind
the breeze on my face start to get calm
and I start to
take the panic out of my system and then
he unfold me from there in the same year
I did three more times the same
experience until I felt like was just
another day in the park. just do this
like [sighs]
and I
so that shows my commitment with my own
fears with my own I was upset because I
get panic and I was trying to fix my
panic on the carpet in home
was not a doctor was not a pill was not
a conversation was just brutally
stay in the hole until you get killed
you know it's like so that's kind of
commitment I have in a very early age to
be the best I can be.
And for me breathing was always a not a
problem but was something which when you
get panic you panic man. Everything all
the strategy all the thinking all the
goes to to to to the drain.
So I was focused on not get panic and
then I learned how to breathe and this
was the missing link in my life.
The breath.
The breath. I I saw you also do like
cold water exposure. It seemed like you
did a lot of things to make yourself
extraordinarily uncomfortable.
Yes. And uh functional strength. I never
learned functional strength. I invent
functional strength in my mind playing
with elastics which I never heard about.
I bought elastics from diving the ones
you put on the
You just had an intuitive sense that it
would work.
Yeah. It have to be a a resist a
consistent resistance. I have to move
but with resist. So I I put in elastics.
I put in light weights and start to do
like crazy. And also the cold water.
Cold water is a very important treatment
for me because
if you're thinking about something who
going to scare you the most
is get burn alive.
Second is get cold water because give
you chills from immediately like I don't
like that. It's like putting a cat in
the water. I hate that every touch,
every com is is the uncomfortable is
superb. You're just not going to get
killed or going to get hurt. But
mentally, you could not be in a more
stressed situation than being in the
ice.
So I felt that will be a good learning
ground for me. So I was using the ice
bats.
How did you get introduced to that? Like
you're doing stuff back in the I mean
are we talking the 80s? Like,
yes,
you're doing this stuff back in the 80s.
I didn't hear about this stuff until
like 2015. I mean, this is
Yes.
crazy.
Because I was seeking for things were
giving me chills and emotions. And I
love to play with nature because nature
is unbreakable. Nature is stronger. So,
surf for me plays always a a double
role. First, the sport of surfing, the
the delightful element of playing the
the ocean. M
the the second is the energy of the
ocean is how the ocean moves and you
cannot fight the ocean. You have to go
into the channel. If you get caught, if
you lost your board, you cannot just
swimming back through the channel. You
have to get pounded on your head and go
from the waves. So you have to have a is
a is a is a ways to do it to deal. One
time I lost my board and I had very
heavy surf and the in the very late
afternoon
I was by myself in the ocean and I lost
in the I I I thinking about the back the
last set I wouldn't get. So I get one
more wave I got deep. So I when I was
about to get the set I get one pound in
the head and I broke my leash and I was
already out there getting dark by myself
with the channel pushing me towards the
ocean. and I was by myself. So, I have
to be calm enough to to just go through
the ocean and then eventually go
sideways through the along the beach for
about an hour and 10 minutes and then go
back to the ocean to back to the sand
and I arrive on the sand about 9:00 at
night.
Wow.
Thanks God for for being alive and lost
my board. But that's g me a sense of
calmness. under pressure and and and so
I was not intent to do that but as I put
myself in that situation I could use
this as a positive experience.
So Hixon you're now moving into a
different phase of your life. Do you
feel as alive now as you did when you
were a champion or do you think about it
differently?
No, I don't feel better
but thankful I'm not feel worst because
what I could do with very very
graciously and very motivated and
inspired for me was lost was changing
the focus from if you imagine yourself
in a pyramid. I always focus on the top
of the pyramid efficiency
and and competition and and proving
jiu-jitsu is the best.
But for the last 25 years or so,
jiujitsu has been growing based on the
and and becomes more competition aspect
tournaments and submission tournaments,
grappling tournaments and and they
become
I feel like they losing the the martial
arts spirit becomes a game without that
spirit. And now for me my goal is not
only not to force or to show details for
better fighters but to give a more
accessible base for people who not
fighters and they need something to
really grow.
Because if you put yourself in
perspective of
of how much you can grow from juujitsu
practics,
I tell you, you can double your
perception of yourself in terms of
of understand your gauges of tiredness,
of sharpness in your mind, possibilities
of strategy, calmness, emotional
control. Every tank you have you don't
put a test because you're not playing
when you start to playing
you start to understand the physicality
the the techniques the movements and
that's give you a perception which I
call invisible power you start to
develop a better sense of balance you
start to develop better sense of
deflection and not get punched or how to
respond to so based on that learning
process you start to become more
confident
you start to
humanize yourself. Another big problem I
see today is the fact
technology,
robotics, internet dehumanize you.
We become [snorts] half humans and half
this universe we live here. So you can
be anywhere, you can talk with anyone,
you can see any tree. So everything is
there. But it's not the ability to shake
hand to look somebody in the eye to to
just for a job to talk with a girl to to
be present human you know we are humans
we have to eat we have to to connect
relationships so the humanizing doesn't
make you strong in relationships doesn't
make you strong and in your presence
jiujitsu just the hug just the breathing
together just the give you that sense of
presence the sense of of connection
which is very important and you not feel
how much is important for you but
because you're not sometimes you feel
like you spend your time without feeling
a hug feeling the sweat feeling
something which is very so juu can also
help you in that matter of of supporting
your life not as a fight because today
this is winning fighting this is win
without a Right? I can give you tools
for you to become more peaceful, more
connected with yourself, more sensitive
to others, better in relationships,
better in your sense of believing in
yourself for an endeavor.
And you're not going to you don't have
to spar with nobody. The concepts I
change in my teaching progress now is
before in the first month you're going
to learn some techniques and you and the
first month and the end of the first
month you're already sparring
and that sparring session can be very
positive for some warriors but can be
jeopardizing a lot of guys who are not
designed to fight. In what way does it
jeopardize them emotionally? Yeah,
because if you come in to learn
techniques and you amazed by, oh, I like
the tech and you come in and I pull you
to spar with a 17-year-old brutal,
aggressive with nothing in their head
and he coming to grab
so hurts and discomfortable and agony
and you're going to say, "F I don't I
don't I don't want that in my life. The
guy's stupid. He's so if you get too
soon involved with the the the actual
competition aspect
jeopardizing your your learning process
in martial arts which I believe the
first year right now I'm sure the first
year of practice has to be learning
practicing with a a a training partner
not with an opponent. the opponent
you're just going to face not in the
first month, not in the second month,
but you're just going to face when you
say, "Yeah, I feel like I want to learn
a little more how to get a belt." And so
now you're going to start to go here,
John, come here. So you try to see who
who falls on top. And then you start the
competition, but you have first to get a
a deep understanding of the the purpose
and the ideas. And you may never like to
to compete. And you're going to say, you
know what, Hixon, I want to keep the the
the fundamentals program, which I feel
sh in shape. I feel the knowledge. I
feel the possibilities.
I add to my myself, but I don't want to
compete, you know? I just don't like it
because the average attendance for a
jiu-jitsu school those days is for every
10 students who come into your to the
class, new students, eight will leave in
less than six months.
Wow. So that drop off means
that it's too hard too soon.
You know, if I keep under my attention,
I can keep a student passionate about
for the first two years easy and he's
getting shape. He gets to learn how to
to do the things, but he don't have to
aspire.
Hixon, your wisdom is
incredible. what you've learned from
fighting and just life in general is
really breathtaking. The book was
amazing. Your life story is truly
unbelievable. It is inspiring in ways
that I can't articulate. Where can
people connect with you? Where can they
buy the book?
Uh the my my new site now is
hixon.academy.
The book is all over is like a a big
release in the four corners of the
world. Japan, UK, Europe, US, Brazil.
So, it's not going to be hard to find.
And what's the title for people?
Breed.
Because breed, I think, was the
is the initial process of enlightenment
and and performance and understanding
and spirituality. If you cannot control
your heart, if you cannot control your
brain, you're in bad shape. So breathing
is a big inspiration for me and was the
turning point of my evolutionary
process.
Yeah, the book is really amazing.
Thank you, my brother.
Thank you so much for coming on.
My pleasure.
Guys, trust me, you're going to want to
read the book. If you don't already know
who he is, you are going to be
absolutely blown away. The book is part
memoir. It's all mindset. It's exactly
what he did to become arguably the
greatest fighter of all time. when you
get into like real fighting circles,
this is the name that comes up over and
over and over again. Uh the documentary
Choke, one watch of that and you will
understand exactly why. Uh it's it is a
career that's truly unparalleled and uh
I think you guys will get a lot out of
reading the book and spending time with
him online. It's really really
extraordinary. And speaking of things
that are extraordinary, if you haven't
already, be sure to subscribe. And until
next time, my friends, be legendary.
Take care. You know, a lot of us are
going through a hard time in life. Some
people have been bullied. Some people
are just stressed out. Some people are
insecure. Some people are fat and
overweight. And the world puts a lot of
this in your mind.
It's not just you. Yeah. You help it.