Kind: captions
Language: en
the question I ask everybody is if you
got the exact same genes I mean there's
small uh variations from mutation and so
forth but effectively to same genes why
do you look different well it turns out
it's not your genes it's which of those
genes are on and which of those genes
are off and it's not only All the Rage
it's also all the excitement of this
idea can you reverse your epigenome to a
younger
State Peter D mandis welcome back to the
show Tom it is a pleasure it's been way
too long my friend it has been Co really
messed up my rhythms and all of that and
then I am super excited that you've
published a new book which we're going
to be talking all about but I want to
know so when you and I first met it was
really all about space yes and
exponential Technologies and now we've
really shifted into regenerative
medicine he healthtech biotech
regenerative
uh longevity age reversal whatever terms
you want um yeah I age reversal
personally yes I and we'll talk about
that yeah and I've become obsessed with
David Sinclair who you guys talk about
in the book I have found fundamentally
as I've gotten older that my mindset and
what I focus on has changed in ways that
I wouldn't have predicted so until I was
probably 44 45 I was I just thought
about living forever all my plans were
about living forever and it really
didn't sink in the usefulness of
thinking about the fact that I am going
to die and then at about 45 it switched
for me and it started to feel more
useful to think about the fact that we
might not hit escape velocity in my
lifetime oh we're going to hit it baby
and and then I had a year where it was
like I I don't think it will happen for
me and then I read David Sinclair's book
yes and I thought this might actually
happen yeah and that was the first time
in a while where I thought maybe I was
pessimistic for a minute why are you so
optimistic is it regenerative medicine
like what is it that really clicked for
you my early life my first 40 years of
life I'm 60 now my early conations you
look amazing thank you I feel amazing I
feel like you know 20 I have an internal
mental age of 28 and I've got a you know
a biological age of 49 and a half so we
we can talk about that um my first 40
years were space no question about it it
was like Star Trek and Apollo we're
going there then I met Ray Kur uh read
his book The Singularity is near we
started Singularity University together
and I became enamored with exponential
Technologies computation sensors
networks AI robotics 3D printing
synthetic biology arvr blockchain all
those Technologies being the tools to
solve the world's biggest problems right
and so that merged well with the work I
do at X prise and it was about 8 years
ago and this was around the time that
you and I were were uh really becoming
friends and connecting that I became
enamored with the idea of longevity I'd
always been interested in longevity when
I was in medical school I
remember watching a TV show on Long
lived sea life that certain species of
whales like the boohead whale could live
for 200 years and the Greenland shark
could make it to 4 or 500 years and I'm
like thinking there's a jellyfish that's
based basically Immortal Immortal yes
yeah and you know and sea turtles you
know are thought to be hundreds of years
and I'm I'm thinking if they can do it
why can't we right I mean seriously
that's so you though like the the that's
one of the things that I love about you
is that you just refuse to accept things
as they are it's like no I can make this
better yeah well I was thinking at that
moment that it's either a hardware
problem or a software problem and that
we're going to get the tools to fix that
and we are with happening right now will
you define that for me at the cellular
level so in my head I was trying to
figure out which you consider hardware
and which you consider so I consider the
software The genome and the epigenome um
so our DNA your your the DNA and The
Meta structures around the DNA we'll
talk about the epigenome and the uh
Hardware I consider the you know
cellular organel and uh the structures
of the cell um and they they sort of
have a blurry definition between them uh
but at the end of the day uh the tech
it's it's really the fact that biology
has become a a digital Tech as well
right we've digitized biology we've
turned into ones and zeros we are
sequencing so when the NIH first
sequenced the human genome we have 3.2
billion letters in our genome 3.2 from
our mom 3.2 from our dad and uh the
Human Genome Project cost about3 billion
and took a decade to get a sequence uh
Craig Venter uh did it in about um N9
months with $100 million so crazy and
since then we've seen this precipitous
drop I mean we're talking five times
faster than Mo's law the speed at which
computers are getting better right five
times faster and we're down now to you
can sequence a genome uh in about 7
hours right and costs are below a th
there's you know question of whether and
the and the prediction from alumina the
the major sequencing company out there
is that will get down to an hour and 100
bucks right so I mean it's the point
where enter the hospital and your
sequence like it's like check your BP
sequence you you know see what's going
on it it is so how targeted are things
getting now in terms of taking that
sequencing actually knowing something
from it and targeting the whether it's
still early days still early days uh
where it's having an impact is in cancer
uh therapies so being able to to
sequence the cancer uh that someone
biopsies and saying okay this cancer is
going to be uh only radiation uh uh you
know affected by radiation therapy this
one can take a a chemotherapy or more
importantly we're going to create a
specific Gene therapy or crisper therapy
or vaccine therapy against that cancer
is anybody running AI against the so
when you have the simple mutations where
it's like this disease is related to
this Gene and that's it there's no
complex interactions but as as we go
beyond those things and get into the
more complex things is anybody running
AI to start assessing it's actually
these 72 different Gene interactions
that cause whatever that's the dream
that is the dream and doing that yet
well it's being done um you know human
longevity when it was uh Bob hurry Craig
Venter and I put that company together
and you you know that um the vision was
large scale genome sequencing and at the
same time large scale phenotype
assessment you know full body MRI all of
that information and then sorry so that
people that don't know phenotype
phenotype is the way that your genes
Express so I look at you and what but I
see that's your phenotype pH you're
trying to get a correlation you're
trying to get a correlation between
everyone with these active these
genes um and this
environmental uh impact ended up with
this kind of a cancer or everyone more
importantly who had these genes um
eating this kind of diet uh lived longer
or you know so there how how do your
genes impact uh your workout your diet
all of those things and what we're
learning is that genes are not your
destiny right it's very important to
know and you know this from your own
personal work um in in weight loss and
diet and mindset um it's your obsession
uh that you can your epigenome we'll get
into that uh Epi from the Greek word
above your epigenome is uh which genes
are on and which genes are off you can
think about your 3.2 billion genes or
3.2 billion uh you know nucleotides
letters in your your DNA alphabet uh
which is tens of thousands of genes as
those genes are sort of the the keys on
a piano I was going to ask you so and
maybe and the piano player is your epig
genome okay so let me just push on that
for a minute I have my DNA it's got
these four letters they repeat over and
over and over and over and
over those groupings of letters which
are
revealed through methylation which we'll
get into in a minute but what what is
revealed in my very complexly wrapped
DNA yes will determine what that cell
becomes because my DNA strand contains
all the genes all of the genes together
um well so all of the genes have to be
broken up into in this place play this
note to go with your piano analogy but
over here so in the eye play the eye
notes in the knee play the knee notes in
the brain play the brain notes yes and
so you've got this long ass string of
DNA CU it for most people I'll assume
because it for me this is how it is that
you get the concept of DNA you get the
concept of genes you don't really know
how they relate so let me let me break
it down your 3.2 billion letters are
broken up into 23 chromosomes and we
sort of remember that from our high
school biology right
and those chromosomes
are uh super tightly wrapped in compact
right if you stretched out the DNA from
a chromosome it would be meters long but
it it's raveled together and if it when
it's so Compact and raveled in the
structure and using these proteins
called histones um the DNA becomes very
difficult to read now what do you mean
read the DNA so the DNA a gene has a
start and an end and typic TYC Al it is
red um with a uh transcription uh
process that turns from your DNA to a
messenger RNA and from a messenger RNA
to a protein a protein can be an enzyme
it can be actin amiin from muscle it can
be all kinds of things proteins are sort
of the structural building blocks
they're the major operating uh carrier
of operations in the body and so if your
DNA is so tightly wound that you can't
actually read it then it's
inert um and so the DNA needs to be
opened up in certain points to be read
to have an appropriate translation into
proteins and in the beginning um when
life begins we have a a plur potent stem
cell so a stem cell and plur poent means
it can become anything that stem cell
can become uh heart liver lung kidney
skin brain whatever it might be uh cell
and it's super
specialized um and it's super
specialized because like you said the
part of the DNA that codes for keratin
or whatever the right protein is in in
hair and skin uh is revealed but the
other parts that might make a nerve cell
are are bound up and
hidden so that process of uh of which
genes are turned on and which genes are
turned off is called the
epigenome now it gets interesting to our
age reversal conversation which I I
think will will sort of dominate our
conversation here uh is if I said to you
Tom you've got the exact same genes at
Birth at 20 at 40 at you know when
you're 80 so why do you look different
why don't you have like you know you
probably do have a ripped sixpack but
what why why don't you look like you
were look like when you were 20 um thank
God thank God in your case my body
better face maybe not so much but yeah
so the question I ask everybody is if
you got the exact same genes I mean
there's small uh variations from
mutation and so forth but effectively to
same genes why do you look different why
don't you look like a baby or like an
80-year-old man well it turns out it's
not your genes it's which of those genes
are on and which of those genes are
off and that's called your epig genome
and it's not only All the Rage it's also
all the excitement of this idea can you
reverse your epigenome to a younger
State this episode is sponsored by
Future go to Tri future. cimpact to get
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$19 you can also click the link at the
top of the episode description now enjoy
the episode so the question is and this
is what I found really interesting about
David Sinclair and his work is an
amazing book called lifespan and I
commend it to everybody it's absolutely
phenomenal your book life force and
lifespan go together extraordinar
beautiful onew punch for real um and
what's interesting is I never really
understood what was causing Aging in the
first place and so walk us through the
what methylation should do and then his
idea what does he call it d
differentiation X differentiation X
differentiation I think where basically
a cell should be an ey cell and it
starts to break down and maybe it's
revealing a little bit of like here's
some of the skin cell here's a nerve
cell like a fragment of it and so the
the and and helping people understand
what's happening in the cell that there
are actually little things proteins
moving around like reading this stuff
the cell when you look into the cell it
is insane the level of complexity within
complexity within complexity it's Mor
literally morac ulous that we are alive
and what is going on you know we have 40
trillion cells in our body right 40
trillion cells and each of them is a
living organism and we don't think about
the fact that we're this massive
collection of cells collaborating to
have this conversation and then within
our body we get into it but are all of
the bacteria and vir and all of that
which outstrip the number of human cells
in us okay back to the original point so
you're born
uh uh you're in the womb your placenta
uh is actually the organ that generates
all the stem cells uh that manufacture
the baby I think of the placenta is a 3D
printer that manufactures the
manufactures the baby and you're born
and um you your body goes through a
pre-programmed uh process that uh allows
you to mature into adulthood
now uh there's a series of seven genes
um called the ceran genes and these
genes are producing these ceran
proteins and these are the Lynch pin uh
of Aging it's the work that David
Sinclair and George Church have done so
beautifully and it turns out that your
ceran genes and proteins have um a dual
function that are critical for your uh
for your life and they're competing
functions so let me take this uh a step
at a time so your ceran genes one
function is they're in control of your
epigenome they're
controlling which genes are on and which
genes are off and we'll get to
methylation a little bit but but that's
a really important function for them is
keeping uh your genes your ey genes and
ey Gene your skin genes a skin Gene and
so forth so the epigenome is controlled
and they do that by detecting damage in
the DNA and rep well so that's the
second function no they're they're doing
this by controlling certain methylation
proteins and and which hide or reveal
which hi to reveal so the ceran genes
are uh have a function of of controlling
the epigenome to make sure that the
right genes are are being ex opened uh
to be red and the right jeans are being
closed and what process do they use for
that in this first part it is
controlling the methylation of the DNA
okay so the DNA let's go there the DNA
um uh is methylated at different
locations a methyl group is a is a
carbon with three hydrogens and when you
methylate it uh it hides the ability for
that piece of DNA to be red it it will
stop it from from being red and when you
demethylate it it can open it up and
there are methylation uh transcription
factors that the ceran genes are
impacting
here um so if they're doing their job
they're controlling the epigenome
appropriately in that cell but the ceran
genes have a competive itive job which
is they're in charge of DNA repair at
the same time and so as we are
experiencing life I wouldn't say aging
but experiencing life we are constantly
being hit by cosmic rays uh especially
when we're flying at 48,000 ft in the
upper atmosphere uh secondhand smoke uh
other chemical mutant uh uh mut gens and
so we're accumulating uh DNA damage in
our cells and the number I heard was
like it's between a th to a million um
mutations a day per cell I mean it's a
lot so there's a lot of work per cell
per cell Jesus it's crazy okay um but
what does that damage look like G gets
knocked off in a search so it's a few
things it can be a single strand break
it can be a double strand break it can
be a um uh and so it's breaking of the
DNA and that is happening from uh from
oxidation it's happening from you know
uh free electrons if you would hitting
the DNA and it's it's nicking the the
DNA and then what happens is you've got
all you have incredible repair
mechanisms that are there and uh if you
have a double strand break right DNA is
double stranded if it breaks uh you've
got a one system that will fix double
strand brakes um and you have another
system that will fix a single strand
break and there's a number of different
repair systems there which frankly I
have forgotten since medical school but
just amazing what what able to do and
sometimes when they make the repair they
instead of a uh a g they'll put a t and
that's when you have a a permanent
mutation that can lead to a cancer now
there because that's effectively created
a new Gene at that point it's modified a
gene okay and that that you have four
letters H TC and G and those letters in
groups of three code for an amino acid
as part of a protein and um long story
short the cerin are helping you maintain
your genes in proper working order it's
helping you repair your genes now here's
the challenge
cerin are powered by uh NAD plus
nicotinamide Adine D dinucleotide NAD
uh and NAD is sort of the energy
currency in your cells uh how does that
relate to uh ATP so it is ATP and NAD
are in the same in the same cycle okay
right and they're uh you're using ATP to
activate your
NAD
um
NAD Powers a
cerin the challenge is that your NAD
levels inside your cells drop
precipitously after 40 interesting right
more than half so you're you're slowing
your ability to repair I want you to
let's use the piano player analogy um uh
the genes that you're
playing uh as the epigenome you're
playing the proper piano at the same
time as a ceran you're over here fixing
something so you're going from playing
the piano to fixing something and
playing the piano to fixing something
and you need food to keep yourself going
but all of a sudden you're spending more
and more time fixing something because
the DNA damage is accumulating and the
amount of food you have or in my case
coffee to to drink is reducing and so
I'm gotten less energy and I'm being
distracted and having to fix the DNA and
I'm losing control of playing the
piano right so all of a sudden your
epigenome is becoming
confused uh your Skin's skin is not
making the right
proteins to keep it elastic and and
smooth and it's it's falling apart and
so that from David Sinclair's book and
we talk we have an entire chapter on
David in fact one of the things we do is
we uh Tony and I in the book uh have a
number of Heroes that we go deep into
and David who's a professor of genomics
at uh at Harvard Medical School he's
brilliant he's one of the top brilliant
thinkers long story short that's what's
going on this competition between
repairing DNA and controlling your Pome
and having your NAD levels fall over
time uh is what's driving us to look
older at age 80 or 90 or 100 are you
supplementing N I am I'm not so uh
that's one of the one of the elements so
it turns out that
um you want you want to boost your NAD
levels in your cell and there are you
know people go and get uh
NAD uh IVs the problem is uh at least
according to David and a few other
uh uh scientists who I who I believe
their their work and there's not a
carrier to take the NAD from in the
bloodstream into the
cells and so what you want to do is
supplement it and there are two
precursors to NAD one is nmn and the
other one is NR
um and those we can transport into c
those can get into the cell and in
higher levels in the cell they drive
higher levels of NAD so I take a gram of
NAD of nmn every morning um and then I
take uh uh another supplement basis that
has nicotinamide Rob aide NR in it and
between those two uh for me it's working
to maintain now do I know that they're
increasing or is it this on faith it's
on on faith we're you know I hope that
the ability to measure it
intracellularly will become easier
because it's not easy today but
theoretically it should be supporting it
and I feel great and I've got more
energy than I've ever had um and there's
a few other supplements in the book we
talk about something called mibb 626
which is an nmn analog that is in Trials
right now and it's going to go through
not so nmn and NR are supplements you
can buy them on the web
there's 100 different versions The
Challenge is that a lot of them uh are
not in a crystallized form and they
break down easily in any kind of heat on
shipping they may last 30 days and so
just you know please uh look into it we
write about it uh in in life force about
uh that that fact that they're not all
the same do you guys have a resource on
Fountain life to so if you go to life
force.com there are two uh you can order
the book there but then there are a
number of resources there one is for
Fountain life the other one is for uh my
uh my life force where there are uh a
number of recommended supplements that
you can get access to there but that's
not that's not the purpose here when I
really get into the book's mission is to
give people hope hope and to give people
a game plan of what they can do MIB
626 comes out of a a company called
edenrock uh the founder of Eden Rock Ed
shulock attended one of my Su executive
programs 10 years ago after selling his
you know exiting with tens of millions
from one of his companies and got so
enamored with biotech that he's built
this multi-billion dollar biotech
company that is extraordinary and one of
the things working with David Sinclair
is they've created a a uh nmn uh analog
molecule that they're taking through FDA
approval right now and it's been secret
for a while it was just revealed that
the special forces have been doing a
trial with them using the special uh
molecule MIB
626 to increase uh the special for's
ability for energy and work working out
in long duration and to increase
cognitive capabilities and so you know I
can't say too much more but there's the
potential of SWAT would break in and
yeah there's a potential for having uh
truly
pharmacological agents that are
available to us that increase our
ability to have muscle and strength and
cognition say it for me one more time
MIB 626 does EX exactly what so right
now from there was an article written it
was leaked out of uh US Special Forces
that they're using it to increase uh uh
endurance and strength and is it playing
on the NAD pathway it it's it is it is
supplementing uh more effectively NAD in
the cells interesting and also is this
out like are you supplementing it's not
available yet no it's in it's in very
strict trials instead of going a
supplement route they're going an FDA
trial route which will enable them to
make specific claims because they'll
have the
data and uh you know hopefully in two
years three at the outmost it will
become something that your physician can
uh can order for you I love the uh story
that that Ed shulock told me about one
of his friends who was a world champion
chess player in his 50s and early' 60s
he now he's in the 70s but he's
supplementing with this molecule and
he's now back up to World Championship
chess playing so I mean we all want to
live into our 80s 90s hundreds the
question is you don't want to be
drooling in a wheelchair yeah I mean
cognitive function is one of the most
important things the the supplement that
the Chess Master is taking is that uh
the MIB 626 yes that's the one and I I'm
I'm excited to get my hands on it as
soon as I can but I kiding but does that
so if if I'm understanding what you're
saying correctly about the n ad pathway
and I'm basically giving the energy to
the cumans that they're going to need to
both play and repair so that'll make
sense but if if taking that is improving
my cognition is is it that the cells are
actually being repaired better I don't
know other than to say your brain is one
of you know is is using 30% of your
body's energy output at any one time
it's disproportionate right thinking is
so you might just be feeding it better
maybe yeah and of course the brain is is
interesting yeah it is it is fascinating
um you keep giving me the chills like
this is so this is why I'm so excited
about it right so i' I've switched my
Venture fund bold Capital to instead of
all exponentials were like 70% into
biotech and health it's like the biggest
business out there I've started four
companies in the last couple of years in
the biotech healthtech longevity space I
just think there's no bigger Market it's
like for me I want to make as much
Capital as I can in that space and then
I'll go back to the space space right
yeah God this is so intriguing so the
more I have forced myself to understand
the mechanisms that are happening yes
the one more intrigued I have become but
two it's really beginning to influence
the things that I'm doing so uh I'd love
to talk to you about diet and it's funny
how slow I am to actually change my diet
but that I start talking about it long
before I do um so I have historically
been way heavy on meat and it makes me
feel so good I just could not wrap my
head around when I have tried a heavier
plant-based diet I haven't felt as good
as I do with meat then exploring the
ideas that you guys talk about very
eloquently in the
book and beginning to understand that
okay if red meat is triggering mtor and
mtor is triggering growth and growth is
giving my body the signal everything's
abundant all is well um but the very
thing that makes you live a long time is
sending the body the signal yoyo things
may not be like going as well in the
environment as we think you better like
you know kind of constrict a little bit
hibernation right exactly which is why
um caloric restriction is the only thing
they've seen work across every species
they've ever tried it on in terms of
longevity and when I heard that I was
like oh man so that would explain why I
feel good I you know I can add muscle
mass I feel phenomenal but I'm not
giving my body the signal for longevity
walk me through like so we're going to
talk about uh
four things that I or five things that I
think are important for longevity that
are the basics and we can start with
diet first you talk about sleep you need
to talk about exercise you need talk
about mindset and then the the fifth one
for me
is uh daily annual uploads it's not
dying from something stupid and and uh
it's really really important to talk
about the diagnostic side of the
equation not every diet is right for
every person your diet is really
impacted by your genetics and also by
your gut Flora um and just to be clear
if you had to guess and I know this is a
guess but if you had to guess is it
weighted more towards your microbiome or
weighted more towards your genetics
I I am actually going to guess it's more
towards your microbiome yeah that's my
gut instinct as well okay uh so the
there's certain things that are true and
you know the single most fundamental
part of your diet is sugar is poison
right sugar is causes neuroinflammation
absolutely clear it causes uh uh cardiac
disease absolutely clear right sugar
feeds cancers um and so getting rid of
sugar is is the most important move
anybody can make and do you consider
that just like actual refined sugar as
an ingredient or are you looking at
carbohydrates well I'm also talking
about you know uh low uh high glycemic
index carbs as well stuff that becomes
sugar in your bloodstream bread pasta
white rice yeah so um I am where do you
fall on fruit I eat a lot of
blackberries and blueberries because
they've got additional benefits right I
sort of stay away from melons and orange
juice and and things that become
instantly become sugar in your
bloodstream I I've gone hardcore vegan
and then I've gone hardcore keto and
I've gone back to a Mediterranean so I
will typically eat as much veggies as I
can I mean I'm pounding salads uh
Peppers uh you know just as much greens
as I can and I love a great Greek salad
tons of olive oil right you put cheese
on it I put feted cheese on it I do I
enjoy it's the only cheese I actually
eat is fety chees because it's a harder
cheese because um I'm lactose intolerant
thank God uh and that God interesting
because I think um I think cow milk
today is detrimental there's a number of
studies that show that cow milk is uh in
particular the type of cow milk that's
dominant in the US is is not good for
you and I don't have enough uh science
on the tip of my tongue to back that up
but go and and Google and take a look
around I will supplement that with
typically fish uh salmon when I can uh
do I love a piece of bacon now and then
100% it's you know it's breakfast candy
uh but I try and minimize I don't eat
any red meat I don't uh uh or you know
any uh any beef uh I'll eat some chicken
uh some and some fish fish and but it's
80 90% uh diving into veggies um and
that works for me it doesn't work for
everybody and is any of that so
obviously some of it's just experimental
you've tried it is any of that driven by
this idea of mtor and not wanting to
trigger that pathway so what's Driven
there is uh my intermittent fasting so I
will uh get up I will not eat lunch
until about
2:00 and then I will have a late lunch
and an early dinner um and try not to
overeat and I'll hope to be done by
dinner by 7:00 and then I will Fast till
the next day at 2:00 David Sinclair does
one meal a day at dinner and then he's
he's fasting and so I'm carrying with me
you know this is my uh what on Earth is
that it's athletic Greens in Fiji Water
right so this will be what I drink so do
you think that you're not getting enough
uh of I assume you do the athletic
greens for the micronutrients are you
worried you're not getting enough in all
the salads that you're pounding no um I
this adds probably certain ones that I'm
not getting but it also makes it uh more
enjoyable to drink than just plain water
it does get a bit boring I will give you
that where's your what's your take on uh
carbonated water interesting right so
I've been all over the place I I enjoy
carbonated water and the question is is
it acidifying your your bloodstream or
not so I just listen if if I were
someday to get cancer I'd be going all
alkaline I'd be zero sugar you know it's
just like I'm going to fight it on every
front until then I will uh I'm probably
80% flat and 20% carbonated at dinner
it's like a bottle of of pel of uh what
you call it um yeah pelo pelo
yeah
exactly very interesting so I don't know
what it is I whatever is best for me I'm
always like to the right of that so I
drink uh basically every ounce of water
that I intake is carbonated y so I don't
drink sodas or anything like that sodas
again phosphoric acid and sugar you know
just say no so going back to red meat
for a second so do you avoid red meat
because of the um the correlative
studies on um increased cancer
inflamation yes and i' I've just I've
learned to just not like it as well
after a time it just is you know it's
not what I'm going to eat you know if I
if I'm going to eat anything other than
uh fish a little bit of chicken and a
little bit of pork but that's my
personal you know and again it's really
maximizing the amount of uh of greens of
uh colorful greens
you know uh broccoli uh with olive oil
and lemon is awesome you know who would
have thought I love brussels sprouts do
brussels sprouts are delicious I'm not
sure if they're cooked well I'm not sure
what people's beef are but I will say
that I like brussels sprouts with bacon
I do love brussels sprouts with bacon so
good uh yeah I I am surprised when you
get something cooked well just how
delicious
um vegetar items can be vegan items can
be and and I I will set aside all the
stuff that just you know puts a ton of
sugar in it have you heard of Shu I have
not so rich roll who I think you know
I'm going to see later today amazing guy
phenomenal podcast his wife created this
vegan cheese which after the whole so my
thing I am still eating a ton of red
meat I want everybody to be very clear
but I am going through this intellectual
exercise of exploring this of mtor and
like if if red meat is triggering that
and you need to put your body in a
totally different state in order to um
get the longevity so I'm like okay well
are there vegan things that I can try so
rich ends up sending me some of his
wife's
cheese it is so good I I literally
freaked out I was texting him like homie
this is freakish and so uh yeah I'm
always a little tense when something's
highly processed but nonetheless this
stuff is amazing the ingredient list is
when I see him I'm going to ask them for
something dude it's so good you are
going to love it I I literally can't
believe how delicious they've made this
stuff and that's where I'm like okay
like if if there are things that I can
do that are really delicious and I can
measure and this is where this gets
interesting I can measure its effect on
whether it's my telr or I forget what
the inside tracker what's it called
inside tracker is one yes what is it
they're looking for in that is it
methylation so they're they have uh an
epigenetic clock that because when you
say that you're you're 49 biologically
so it turns out that going back to our
epigenome and the methylation sequence
um uh
there is a methylation pattern that
changes over time and you can measure it
and uh there is a uh a number of Meth a
clocks and so inside tracker uses one uh
Fountain life I think uses the same one
and and so I give some blood and they do
not the DNA sequence but they look at
the methylation and they say you have
the methylation pattern of a 49-year-old
even though you're
60 and so David Sinclair who when the
time we wrote the book was 53 and had a
methylation pattern of someone who was
33 wa right and so that's that's my goal
20 years it's amazing um and so do you
do things and then do the tracker and
look at it and go okay cool I am
constantly varying my supplements my
exercise my diet uh in directions that
are pro- AG reversal and let's let's
talk about some of the other ones so on
the diet side just to summarize you know
the recommendation is intermittent
fasting you know at minimum you know eat
an early dinner you're like 19 hours I'm
yeah I'm roughly 700 p.m. till uh till 1
so yeah that's uh what is that 6 m is 24
18 hours right on the extreme I'll do 1
meal a day but typically it's 8 you know
6 on 18
off uh the second thing uh is I'll try
and you know bring in at least 2 liters
of water a day all right if on a great
day I can do three just pounding water
we are constantly dehydrated we don't
drink enough water I want to ask about
that and I don't I we have more so let's
put a pin and not lose where we were but
every time somebody says to drink that
much water there is a skeptical part of
my brain that's just like from an
evolutionary standpoint there is no way
we had access to that that is a really
great Point um so uh in the book we
provide some of the studies in the
background on on water intake I'm taking
this on gospel truth I don't have the
science behind it um putting that aside
minimizing sugar that's clear
plant-based diet maximizing my plants
intake and then adding supplementing it
with you know I do eat eggs I do eat
fish and so that's more of a
Mediterranean diet which is you know
genetically and you know historically my
background let's go to the next subject
sleep uh evolutionarily
if our species could have evolved to
sleep less it would have been such a
boom to get extra hours in the day for
finding food protecting yourself mating
that we would have slept less but the
fact that we T that we need 8 hours of
sleep uh is a fundamental fact your
brain needs it and I remember when I was
in medical school I used to pride myself
on like I can get by with 5 hours 5 and
a half and that was a stable point for
me and now I pride myself on getting 8
hours I got my aura ring I set the
temperature in the room to 65° I have a
cooling blanket I've got these great
Manta eye shades that are so comfortable
I um you know and I go to sleep I try
and be asleep by 9:30 so I can get up at
5:30 and I'm like did I make 8 hours
it's like I'm I'm trying to I'm trying
to hit that and I think that's really
important have you set a goal to work
out more but don't know which exercises
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guys take care and be legendary
how about you how you doing on sleep
dude I'm freakish about sleep so I one
thing that I will say I'm very proud cuz
I'm definitely a hustle porn guy like
telling people go hard uh but I've
always told people get sleep and that is
a priority in my life so I'm in bed at
900 p.m. like it's a religion yes I
don't set an alarm so I wake up when I
wake up now I will say that there are
times in my life where I am so intense
on something that I end up not getting a
ton of I just wake W up but I know that
if I were to back off and do have less
stress in my life that I would sleep
more so even though I'm not waking up to
an alarm I am doing things mentally that
end up reducing my sleep so I'm not
thrilled with that if you were to track
right now my average per night is
between six and six and a half okay I'm
I'm hitting minimum of seven and I'm
routinely hitting eight hours which I'm
really happy about uh but it's really
getting up and having the energy in in
the morning right so do my best writing
early same yeah it's like I used to be I
remember medical school and graduate
school I was uh you know I'd be pounding
at 2: a.m. and and 3:00 a.m. and and
like that was my and I my schedule was
flipped where I mental
Clarity first two hours of the day yeah
so I don't know how much Credence to
give to corono type but when I was young
so that I went through a period where I
was unemployed and in that period my my
sleep time just kept getting pushed
later and later and later and I realized
I had a problem when I had to set an
alarm to make a 10 p.m. movie and I was
like whoa all right so and you just
start to feel weird one you're not
seeing the sun to you're not really
seeing other people because you know
when you go to the grocery store it's 1
in the morning and so there's two other
people in the store and I was like
something doesn't feel right here and so
I forced myself to get back onto a
normal schedule but um but now I'm like
man when 8:00 comes around I'm like can
I go to bed yet can I go to bed yet so
it's not like somebody has to convince
me to go to bed at 9:00 like I'm ready
to go to bed and uh yeah that's I want
to feel good in the morning I've got 10
and a half year old boys that are
typically in bed at 7:30 and sleep by 8:
and I'm like ready to go to sleep then
too yep it's like I'm like oh God please
go to sleep so I can go to sleep yeah um
so uh sleep is critical uh 8 hours um
let's go to exercise next right I mean
it's still the fundamentals of diet
sleep exercise uh for me I try and get
in my 10,000 steps a day I'll take my
meetings as many meetings as I can
walking uh I'll take my phone calls
walking I'll take my zoom calls on my
phone walking just to get that in and
then I do a heavyweight workout twice a
week and lightweights uh you know every
day how about you uh so I work out four
to five days a week and I do basically
exclusively lifting I won't call it
heavy cuz I used to lift heavy and I
definitely don't do that anymore but I
lift things that I can do say five to
six reps um unless I'm doing something
for deadlifts deadlifts I do ultra High
Reps so like 15 to 20 plus reps uh and I
do that because I had I just kept
injuring my my back and so don't want to
play with that anymore but I find if I
don't deadlift my back starts to hurt so
I've kept it in there but I keep it
ultra high rep now one thing you guys
talk about in the book is and I'm
forgetting the name but where you're not
trying to move the weight you're
actually trying to push against the
almost immovable object yeah so that's a
uh and there's uh Osteo strong is one of
the companies that enables that but it's
it's when you've got a uh a weight even
in you know if you're in curls and
you've exhausted your muscles and you
can bring it up and just hold it until
it it goes down it's that that point of
Maximum contraction and maximum force
and it's signaling the muscles at at
that point you're just trying to Signal
them uh I think the molecule is Denine
monophosphate that that triggers muscle
growth one of the things I think it's
important for people to know is muscle
mass is an indicator of longevity there
is a direct correlation and uh there's a
couple of reasons thought number one uh
your muscles store blood and stem cells
in them and the second is a lot of
people die Post Falls you know uh you
break your hip you break your pelvis is
how my dad passed you know ends up in
the hospital and then there's a
pneumonia and I just hear this story
over and over again I just you know got
my mom a trainer God bless her she's 86
um and it's like I have the dedication
in the book to her saying mom you're
going to make it over 100 please and
it's like get a trainer to keep her
muscles uh toned as much as
possible yeah yeah muscle is a a very
big deal um how do you think about like
when you're so I guess you intake some
meat you intake eggs so not a big deal
but that's one thing that I when I hear
that I start sketching out but between
okay wait I'm going to need to trigger
mtor to build the muscle mass but mtor
is also I won't see directly shortening
I'm yeah I don't know enough to make the
statement so people check me up on this
but this is what I think that mtor is
effectively shortening my life compared
to what it could be if I wasn't
constantly living in mtor so it's this
weird balance of needing the muscle mass
which my understanding of one of the
reasons that muscle mass is so effective
to your point is that it's a storage
mechanism so it's storing uh you just
talked about stem cells blood but also
amino acids and so um oh God I'm
forgetting his name but there's this guy
back at Quest we used to talk to all the
time very accomplished scientist and he
was like you would see like a burn
victim and if they had muscle and within
like 3 weeks their muscle would just be
gone because the body was just stripping
it of the amino acid so it could repair
and rebuild the skin and I was like whoo
that is cuz I had never thought about
that when you lift you realize you guys
talk about this in the book that it does
feel a little cusion and that if you
stop working out you're going to lose
that muscle mass distressingly quickly
yeah and so my thing is okay hold on if
if the body is like you're going to have
to put me in like an adapter die state
for me to put the muscle on and then if
you stop putting me in that state I'm
going to strip you of the muscle
muscle's clearly very expensive the body
is nervous in my work
to hold on to muscle so the question
becomes okay one why is it expensive and
then two what is
it if it's correlated with all cause
mortality what is it doing that makes it
valuable enough that you do want to keep
some but that it does get thrashed
here's here's the a couple of really
important data points here so your body
is constantly remodeling itself and you
know this right bone and muscle remod
model based upon your needs if you don't
need it um you lose it and so if you're
in bed rest bone density and and muscle
uh
disappears
um and the challenge is that our bodies
were never evolved to live past age 30
so if we go back sort of to evolutionary
biology 100,000 years ago on the savanas
of Africa you'd go into puberty at age
12 or 13
and before birth control you were
pregnant and by the time you're now 27
28 years old your baby's having a
baby and back then before McDonald's and
whole food before you know we had
abundant amount of food available
24/7 uh the last thing you wanted to do
to perpetuate the species was steal food
from your grandchildren's mouths and the
best thing you could do was
die right and give your bids back to the
environment and not back your tribe and
so the average human lifespan 100,000
years ago was you know 30ish and even
100 years ago was just 40 um not that
you couldn't live longer but the average
lifespan uh from childhood mortality and
early deaths and everything was was
40 um and so genetically everything that
would kill
you after 30 after reproductive age was
never selected against so all the stuff
in your you know cardiac disease in your
50s and cancer in your 60s and 70s and
uh Dementia in your 80s and 90s was
never biologically selected against and
even retaining muscle mass and bone mass
was never advantageously selected again
if we had if we could reproduce into our
hundreds then the people who had the
most muscle the the most you know
cognition the the most the least disease
their genes would perpetuate and that
would be a positive feedback loop but
that just hasn't been the case muscle is
critically important uh I'll talk about
one of my companies uh that just took
public this year called
vacinity um and it's a super cool
company uh uh it is uh a company that
creates what are called peptide vaccines
right so a peptide is a small sequence
of amino acids it's a piece of a protein
and it's we do these specially designed
uh vaccines I'm a co-founder and vice
chairman of the company the the
brilliant individuals are mayeh who
who's the CEO and L Reese who's the
executive chairman they've built this
vaccine company it's got a covid-19
vaccine which we just got data uh
yesterday we just announced today that
uh it's three times more effective as a
booster than the fiser vaccine W which
I'm super excited about and what
mechanism is it so pepti work so what we
do is we create um a peptide sequence uh
in the shape of part of the covid virus
but it's not the you're not putting mRNA
to create the spike that is then shed
and then picked up we we
generate um part of the shape of the
spike and it's attached to a very we'll
call it a very
provocative uh protein that is um seen
by the by the body is dangerous and
those two combinations cause your immune
system to form antibodies against the
portion of the covid vaccine but it is
uh super mellow there's very low
reactogenicity uh to the vaccine so I'm
hopeful it'll become sort of the safer
booster vaccine
and that's great but that's not what I'm
talking about here we've been able to
also create
vaccines uh against Targets in the body
uh against Alzheimer's against
Parkinson's against uh hyperia which is
stroke and uh heart disease and we're
developing against bone loss and muscle
loss how does that work like if people
are so let's take Alzheimer's which I
imagine is one of the harder
ones what is it they're taret tting CU
not still a big question mark so it's
targeting uh the beta amalo which is
buildup and so if you can Target that
what happens is your body starts
creating antibodies which goes attaches
to the beta ameloid in these these uh
short chain beta Amid and then extracts
them out before they build up obviously
I am not an expert on Alzheimer's but
the idea of beta ameloid plaques being
the ambulance at the uh scene of the
accident rather than the
if we end reming alloid plaqu and it's
actually
toap a virus or whatever um so so far
we're we're entering phase three of the
you know phase one is sa is safety and
it's very safe how long have they been
going down this road doesn't this take a
long time seven years Jesus yeah seven
years um phase two is efficacy and phase
three is efficacy at scale m right so uh
we've completed our phase two we're
getting ready to enter a phase three uh
we're entering Phase 2 on
Parkinson's um we uh which is amazing
it's um Al uh Alpha ccas is what the
target is there so here's in uh in
hyperemia I find it fascinating I have I
have hyperia high LDL right it's genetic
uh my dad had a lot of disease and
atrial fibrillation do you take a Statin
I do not take a Statin I hate statins
super curious to hear more about that
but finish okay so what I have been
taking is a monoclonal
antibod uh called
ratha um that I inject 5 MLS every two
weeks wow into my belly fat or my my my
uh my thigh muscle and that monoclonal
antibody so it's an antibody right that
targets a protein in my liver called
pcsk9 and that protein in my liver is
what generates LDL the bad
cholesterol and so this monoclonal
antibody uh that's very expensive it's
$14,000 a year who right not not cheap
it's not it's not the first second or
third line of defense it's like the last
line of defense cuz people can't afford
it and so the monoclonal antibody is
manufactured in a vat in this in this uh
uh regeneron manufacturing facility I
get it I inject it goes to my liver and
uh and blocks the pcsk9 protein the
antibody attaches and blocks it from
manufacturing
LDL so what we're doing is we are
manufacturing uh a vaccine that you give
yourself every 6
months and the
vaccine activates your own immune system
to create that same antibody for free
wow so your immune system creates this
antibody against the pcsk9 goes to the
liver and blocks it except instead of
$144,000 a year the cost is maybe 100
bucks a year wow right and so now all of
a sudden it can become a first line of
defense and it attacks the root cause of
the LDL production which is then so the
idea is can you
preventively give vaccinated everybody
so you don't produce the heart disease
or the stroke from that from that LDL
and that it becomes exciting now how I
got to the vaccin story was that we are
also um in development of a vaccine
against bone loss and muscle loss and so
imagine imagine if when what are you
targeting um I am I should it's in the
book and I apologize from not
remembering the exact uh targets but
it's basically it's going to be blocking
the osteoclasts which are the cells in
the bone that break down the bone right
so bone is dynamic it's built up by
osteoblast and it's broken down by Osteo
class and it's just the way the if
you're a skier and you're stressing your
bones osteoblasts are building up bones
where that stress is if you're in bed
rest for a month it's breaking it down
and in in muscle um you're you know the
sarcopenia which is the technical term
for for for uh muscle loss uh you can
block the muscle breakdown as well so
imagine if you when you build your
muscle up and you build your bone up
that it it just stays at Mass um one of
the things that's exciting uh I share
with my my dear brother Lou ree who's
executive chairman of this company is
passionate about space so imagine being
able to go and vaccinate the astronauts
before they go to Mars or before they go
to the moon so they don't have the
muscle loss and the bone loss and they
can retain it when they're coming back
and of course the real business
opportunity is in the Aging population
where that's a real issue so it's just
another powerful tool that we talk about
in the book that
vaccines are becoming extraordinary as a
tool and and whether you hate a covid
vaccine or love a covid vaccine it's a
technology that has saved you know tens
if not hundreds of millions of lives and
so Stefan bansal who the CEO madna is uh
is a friend and the work that they've
done is unbelievable right we went from
uh the Wuhan virus sequence sent by
email to labs around the world from
Wuhan uh to a madna vaccine designed in
24 hours whoa and then from that
design to being put into production and
approved for distribution in under a
year now this is something normally
takes 7 to 10 years to do we did it all
in under a year and built the
manufacturing at scale I mean that was
shows us what's possible Right This is
the exponential age that we're living in
so where is madna going next they're
producing vaccines against all the
viruses we accumulate throughout life so
we have cytomegalo virus herpes virus uh
HIV viruses all kinds of things and it
turns out that when you have these
viruses in your
bloodstream they your immune system is
constantly battling to keep them in
check and there's something called imuno
depletion or imuno exhaustion which is
if your immune system is being used to
exhaust is being exhausted by constantly
fighting these indog these viruses that
are in your system never wiped
out then your immune system is not there
to fight
cancer right and one of the things that
people should know is we're always
developing cancers the body is always
developing cancers it's just that your
immune system finds them and zaps
them and so the idea of what madna is
going to go next is to develop vaccines
against all of these
um that generate the antibodies that
keep these in check versus your tea
cells keeping them in check and it's an
amazing vision of where they're going
and so I just think we're going to start
to see these brand new sets of tools
remember I said we need to learn how to
modify our software or hardware and this
is modifying our our Hardware in this
regard wow yeah it's really incredible
what so regenerative medicine is a big
part of the book and it's a big part of
the focus that's something I'm super
excited
about where where is the state of it now
and and maybe even so everyone will
understand the words regenerative and
medicine but what is regenerative
medicine and what's the most exciting
stuff happening yeah sure uh and there's
a lot it's amazing insane so hold on
this is where we have some fun so uh our
B remember I said the placenta is a 3D
printer the manufactures all the cells
that create the fetus and the the
newborn right it's a 3D printer that
manufactures a baby and then as we grow
in our body we have stem cells all over
the place in stem cells in our bones in
our brain in our muscles and they're
there as the uh as the repairment um and
you can think of the body there's a
great analogy uh that uh that Bob hurry
and arbert deg gray have have used of if
your body is a beautiful mansion like
this incredible place that we are right
now and
uh and you have the designs for the
place and you have an army of of repair
repair men and women who are fixing the
place and uh anything goes wrong they
fix it anything goes wrong they fix it
but over time imagine that uh your
repair staff are getting older and dying
off and more scile and damage starts
accumulating and that's effectively
what's going on inside the body so one
of the nine Hallmarks of Aging is is
stem cell depletion so
between uh you know a child at Birth and
someone who is in their 60s 7s 80s '90s
you can see hundredfold to a
thousandfold less stem cells in your
body and and so the repair
mechanisms uh you know are super
weakened uh regenerative medicine is how
do you Revitalize your stem cell
populations how do you you augment them
so uh Bob herui who's also part of the
book the book was principally written by
by Tony myself and Bob help guide a lot
of the the content as well uh he's my
brother from another mother uh he a
great dude yeah he's amazing uh so Bob
was a trauma neurot trauma surgeon
amazing and one day when his daughter
was being born he realized that the
placenta was great growing very large
ahead of the fetus growing like the
fetus was a bean and the planta was
really fully formed and when he and I
were in medical school it was always a
placa was a support organism for the for
the fetus but if that was the case why
wasn't it growing at the same rate as as
the embryo well it turns out it's not
it's generating the the the stem cells
and the cells that are manufacturing the
uh the
embryo and he's the first person to to
realize how powerful the the placenta is
as a source of uh of plur potent stem
cells and uh and immunological cells so
he built a company within cell Gene
that's now part of Bristol Myers uh
called uh so Cene was A1 billion dollar
company he was in charge of cellular
medicine about three years four years
ago I helped him spin that out and we
formed a new company called cellularity
which also just went public this year
it's it's the uh company that is mines
the placenta so we we store hundreds of
thousands of placentas I had my two boys
10 years ago were stored the company
anybody who's listening if your kids are
if you're if you're pregnant or you know
someone who's pregnant it's uh life Bank
USA instead of just storing the cord
blood you can store the placental cells
W and so it's like having the
original boot disc
to go back to early days at computers or
the original computer code of your child
stored eventually to be able to
manufacture backup organs and
manufacture whatever you might need for
that child and so out of the placenta we
extract stem cells we extract exosomes
which exosomes are are the so stem cells
are generating these growth factors and
the growth factors are released by from
the stem cells in these little uh vacul
these little fat contained micr cells
that have no DNA no organel it's just
sort of a exide structure it's an a
bilipid structure with these growth
factor chemicals in them and those are
called exosomes and so it's how they're
excreted from stem cells and they're in
the mure and you can extract them uh and
and so you can so I when I go to
Fountain life every time I get uh I get
these exosomes injected into my
bloodstream versus the stem cells and
their growth factors going into my you
have to find ones that are match no no
really you don't have to worry about
blood type nothing nothing the exosomes
are just the growth factors and I'll
talk about why even placental cells
don't require
matching um because they're they're
immunoprivileged if you think about a
surrogate mother who's carrying a baby
that she's not genetically related to
she doesn't reject the baby and the baby
doesn't reject her and so there's an
immunoprivileged structure there which
is fascinating and very advantageous wow
yeah it's before the cells are are given
an identity of self by the thymus gland
anyway long story short
um the question has been can stem cells
help you regenerate and repair this
entire book got started when Tony was
skiing down you know
snorebucks
he's going to his friends what do I do
it's surge surgery surgery surgery and
he called me up and I said to him to
listen before you have surgery I think
you should really go and try stem cells
and he goes like what should I do and I
said go talk to Bob uh Bob and I set him
up at a at a clinic uh down in Panama he
went down uh he had stem cell treatments
in the joint and intravenously over the
course of three days and as he explains
it uh on the third day
for the first time in in years he stands
up and he's got no pain in his back and
which was an unrelated injury unrelated
and uh and his shoulder
is uh beginning to feel better and
months later on MRI it's completely
healed without any any surgery now
results will vary to be clear uh Tony is
a is air is a miracle unto himself and I
think his mind over matter is is
extraordinary but he got
religion uh I invited him to a
conference uh uh an ex prize event we
were having at the Vatican we were
piggybacking on the uh cure conference
that the pope hosts every every two
years and uh he came and he got so
excited about this and that's when this
book was born and the book opens up with
the story of the Vatican conference and
um his injuries and such and
regenerative medicine is the notion that
we can use uh stem cells and exosomes
and growth factors to help regenerate
our body to help regenerate muscle brain
all of the tissues of our body um a few
other areas so uh you might have heard
about the young blood uh experiments
it's a fun uh Dracula myth here so years
ago in fact Bob hurri did a of this
early work and it was repeated in Amy
wager lab in uh at Harvard if you take
the circulatory system of a young Mouse
in an old mouse and you combine them
it's called
parabiosis the old mouse gets younger
and the young mouse gets older and it's
like what what up you know why is this
happening and so what Amy wager uh did
was she identified a particular
molecule that is
decreasing as we age um and then it's
called
gdf1 and she started giving that to the
old mice and they became younger W and
so uh uh there is a company called
olivian that's uh been designed to turn
that into a a drug they're entering
human trials just now finished with
animal trials and it's being used in
certain conditions um uh but you know
you always and when you're doing an FDA
trial you can't just say it's going to
affect everything you have to pick a
particular point and say we're going to
look at uh uh neuroinflammation or
cardiac conditions or whatever the case
might be and we're going to measure this
uh this disease and these molecule these
uh you know markers and see if they get
modified and so that's exciting um could
that you know uh what have they decided
to Target um uh they are
deci they're targeting the
cardiovascular system in particular uh
and there's again uh we talk about Mark
Allen who's a CEO of that company who's
a friend uh full disclosure bold is an
investor in in olivian uh as is Tony um
and uh we'll see I'm excited about that
I'm always look I think you know the
biggest business opportunities on the
planet are going to be age reversal and
health Tech and biotech and so forth you
you still can't take it with you right
uh so there that's one area another area
of regenerative medicine that is below
your mind level stuff is building organs
this is nuts we're heading towards a
organ abundance so today there are
hundreds of thousands of people on an
organ donor list a lot for kidneys which
is the number one needed and then heart
and liver and lung you know I once wrote
a screenplay about a guy whose wife is
dying he has to go harvest the organs of
bad guys uh to work her up the Unos list
that's that's crazy um so right now if
you need an organ
transplant you're hoping that someone
with an HLA match in other words a match
to your surface antigens
dies and is an organ donor right so I'm
an organ donor I think that's the right
thing to do I check that on the form uh
encourage others to consider as well um
I hope not to die anytime soon but just
you know just putting that out there um
and uh you're waiting for that and then
the
transplants uh if you're in good enough
shape and the organ's good enough shape
but we're we're transplanting a fraction
of the list but imagine a future in
which you have a backup set of organs on
hold for you right like in the Deep
freeze ready to go so there are two
approaches going on right now one by an
incredible entrepreneur Martin rothblat
who you know Martin uh is uh is
brilliant I've known her for 40 years uh
Martine is on her seventh moonshot right
now wow uh she used to be
Martin uh and uh when when she was
Martin she was the co-founder of XM
radio and serus radio she was an uh an F
uh an FCC regulatory lawyer and an
aerospace engineer and amazing brilliant
person not done much with her life yeah
yeah and and uh she had uh a uh uh a sex
change operation remain married to beina
who's brilliant uh a number of kids one
of her one of her kids one of Martin's
change the name to Martin one of
Martin's kids um by the name of Genesis
uh
when she when Martin was now still in XM
radio and serious radio uh is discovered
to have a fatal disease called pulmonary
fibrosis and what does Martin do she
quits her job she sells her shares and
sets out to cure her daughter's disease
damn with no background in biology
starts with a high school Biology book
and camps out the medical library and is
reading every everything on pulmonary
fibrosis and is tracking down and
talking to the doctors and just you know
monom maniacally like I love this Joseph
Campbell quote like a a man whose hair
is on fire seeks water right isn't that
a great quote so good the chills again
yeah and uh goes after that and tracks
down a potential drug that could stay
the course of pulmonary fibrosis for her
daughter who's only got a couple years
of life
left and uh the drug company refuses to
provide it to her and so uh Martin goes
and grabs a whole bunch of great
scientists and advisors and brings it
into her orbit and they go and they
Lobby and they finally get the uh the
drug company to agree to give them
access to that orphan drug which they
had no intention to develop but didn't
want the risk and what Martin gets is a
little baggie of white powder whoa and
she has to go from there to a
manufacturable drug to uh trials and lo
and behold it works and it saves her
daughter's life Wow and in the course of
that she builds a back then 6 billion
company called United Therapeutics that
she's the chairwoman and CEO now it
doesn't stop there cuz Martine realizes
that this drug will stay the course of
pulmonary fibrosis but it doesn't cure
pulmonary fibrosis and now the question
is how do I manufacture
lungs and so she sets out on three
different approaches to manufacture
replacement lungs and her primary one
she hooks up uh with Craig Venter I'm
very proud to have made that
connection and the idea is can you take
a pig that happens to have the same size
heart kidney lungs as
humans and can you modify the surface
proteins of that pig to humanize it make
it humanlike this is so crazy and then
engineer out it's got endogenous
retroviruses that if you put that pig
organ into a human the retroviruses can
pop out and infect the person so you to
zap all the retroviruses modify 10
surface genes on that pig and it was
done and how do they modify the genes
crisper crisper this is insane insane
totally insane and now what happens next
uh they modified it uh about uh 6 months
ago when we're getting ready to publish
and doing last minute changes in the
book Ask Martine so when is this likely
to happen says well by the time your
book is coming out it's going to be real
right on Q uh they do a kidney
transplant uh into as the first one into
a man who was on life support but but uh
their family allowed them to do this as
a test and it went great uh and then
just recently I think about two months
ago they did a heart transplant into a a
recipient who's doing well and so so
hold on we we have taken Pig organs yes
humanized them and for people that don't
know what crisper cast 9 is you
basically go in and edit the DNA yes
insert something else like do you give
it the bit of DNA to insert so yes you
can do that or you can just uh you can
just cut out a particular Gene and a
piece that does something that works in
pigs but does not work in humans and we
cut that bit out and you can then put in
the proper bit uh now I don't actually
know what the exact modifications they
made so I don't want to venture but we
humanized it we humanized it was 10
genes that were modified in the Pig this
is bananas it's bananas it gets even
more bananas so that's the work that
United Therapeutics is doing and you
know uh if you sacrifice like 1% of the
pigs that we eat every year there'd be
enough organs for everybody on the
planet right I mean it's crazy stuff uh
the second thing is one of my favorite
Heroes a guy named Dean Cayman right
Dean Dean is brilliant um people know
him for creating the segue which is the
last thing on the list that he's done
that's amazing uh he uh created the you
know uh the implantable insulin pump
he's created uh the Luke arm for people
who have lost their arms he's created
Luke arm the Luke arm um it's a robotic
arm that allows you to you know
basically I assume it's named after Luke
Skywalker of course yeah love that uh
yeah anyway uh but uh the slingshot
machine that makes purified water from
anything wet um including sewage I mean
it's he's incredible right I won't go I
won't go down that path uh three years
ago he sets out on a journey um backed
by the defense department to build a
machine that in one end goes induced
plur potent stem cells you take a skin
cell you modify it you dedifferentiate
it to a stem cell you put that in and
then over the course of 1 to 3 months
you manufacture an
organ this is so like this is yeah like
yeah and and guess what they've done it
for bone ligament bone segments so if
you need uh a knee operation or an ankle
operation you take some skin cell you
diff dedifferentiate it you put in the
machine and you get out of it bone
ligament bone with your genetic code in
it where they're going next
is going after pediatric Hearts wow and
so their goal is by 2023 next 18 months
you'll put a child's skin cell
dedifferentiate to an induced PL poent
stem cell and I think it's about a
3-month period of time your manufactured
heart comes out for
transplant it's
insane so so that people understand how
this is already happening now what have
we done in animal models with hearts in
particular because I know the punchline
but for people that don't I think this
will be it cuz hearing to oh in 18
months will be making human organs I'm
like no way but if you hear some of the
stuff that's already being done it
starts to seem pretty real so so Tony
atala's lab uh at Wake Forest Tony's
been manufacturing stem cell derived uh
simple organs for some time he's
manufactured
bladders uh the skin is an organ so full
thickness skin with the epidermis and
dermis for transplant like if you're a
burn victim right being able to go from
your skin stem cells and manufacture
sheets of your skin that you could then
transplant in uh they've manufactured uh
micro beating Hearts uh you know few
centimeters in size
um uh one of the things uh uh there's a
friend uh Deepak Shava who's the
president of the Gladstone Institute up
up in Northern California and the work
that he's done again blows me away I
call it cellular Alchemy your heart is
made up of uh myocytes muscle cells
beating cardiac myocytes that you know
beat on a regular rhythm and connective
tissue uh fibr
blasts and when you have a heart attack
uh the muscle tissue dies and the
connective tissue replaces it but it's
all of a sudden it's not beating and so
your cardiac output can be significantly
reduced and what Shava has done is uh
been able to uh use gene therapy to
convert those fibro blasts into myocytes
so you turn the connective tissue into
beating heart once again
right because the genes are there
they're just differentiated as
connective tissue and not as heart
muscle cells dude people are finding
ways to tell a cell to be something
different yes that's so like sci-fi it
is I I love cellular Alchemy CU that's
my favorite I I gave it that name cuz I
love it CU it describes what we're
talking about literally like the idea so
Alchemy if anybody's not familiar the
the pursuit of turning lead into gold
right so taking one thing and making it
another but at the cellular level
because the cells contain the full DNA
if you know the sequence of chemicals
I'm not sure what the actual thing is
but whatever that thing the the Alchemy
part is it actually works like this is
okay nuts I have to talk about one more
thing before we're out of time uh which
is the revolution in
Diagnostics so I said uh for living as
long as you can uh
it's food exercise sleep mindset is so
critically important I'll come to that
next and then not dying for something
stupid so it turns out most everyone out
there is an optimist if you go up to
someone in the street and say do you
have cancer growing in you do you have
an aneurysm do you have any problems
that you should know about it's like
pause no I feel great right and I don't
want to go to the doctor because I don't
want to know which is of course
you want to know because you can do
something about it so um one of the
companies that we built uh uh Fountain
life and there's a a sister company uh
uh the health nucleus at human longevity
down in San Diego Fountain life is in uh
four cities and will be in a dozen
cities in the next uh in the next 18
months um I just went there two days ago
down in the facility
Naples and I get uploaded every year and
that upload involves about 5 hours of my
time I go and I get a full body MRI uh
brain MRI brain vasculature coronary
MRI uh I then uh and it's looking for
any sign of any cancer it's looking for
a sign of any aneurysms or any
aberration and then I did what's called
an AI enabled clearly coronary CT long
story what it's doing is it's a it's a
CT of your heart
um using artificial intelligence to
analyze the blood vessels uh you
probably heard about calcium scores
right is your heart are your heart
vessels calcified and you like oh my God
you got a calcium score of a thousand
that's terrible or calcium score of zero
that's great calcification actually
doesn't matter because if your if your
plaque in your coronary artery is
calcified if it's hard you're fine it's
not going to rupture it's only if if
it's uded that you're concerned what the
clearly CT does is it looking for soft
plaque that isn't calcified yet that
could rupture and that's what really
truly matters and so it's changed
completely how we look at cardiac
disease uh we do a dexa scan looking at
muscle and bone uh we do your genome
your gut microbiome uh all of your omix
it's about 150 gigabytes of data wow and
I go every year I feel naked until I go
through it and
then I you know if I'm going to find
something it's okay I'm going to attack
it and fix it so we're all optimists
about our health and everyone knows
about someone who went to the hospital
and oh my God you've got stage three or
stage four cancer it didn't happen that
morning yeah right if you detect cancer
at stage three or stage four your chance
of a cure is like 10% if you detected at
stage zero or stage one it's like 99%
wow right so it's not it varies for
different cancers but the idea is we're
all developing cancers your immune
system hopefully catches it but
otherwise we give people a Grail test as
well so for me Fountain life is like one
of the most important uh Reinventing How
We Do How We Do health care and one of
the things we just launched which I'm so
proud of is Fountain health and it's a
so wrote in my last book um the future
is FAS than you think that the insurance
industry is perverted when you get when
you get fire Insurance it pays you after
your house burns down life insurance
pays you after or pays your next can
after you're dead health insurance pays
you after you're sick so we created
Fountain Health as a health insurance
it's available for companies right now
50 employees or more and then it will
grow from there but when you get found
health insurance which is the same price
as regular health insurance you get all
the tests included at no additional cost
because our goal is to uh to catch any
disease first
before uh it becomes something that's
expensive to treat later on dude this is
amazing I'm very sad that we have a hard
stop today and we have reached it but
dude the book is phenomenal I loved it
and this catchup was absolutely amazing
where can people find you and learn more
about all this incredible stuff so
Twitter and Instagram it's @ Peter
dandis Fountain and uh uh my life horse
which are the products that uh we
support and then I created something
called Longevity insider. org it's an AI
engine that scans the world's news
looking for exponential Technologies
impacting vitality and longevity and it
generates a uh a newsletter of the top
15 breakthroughs every day on longevity
and it's free and you can unsubscribe
you don't like it but it just keeps me
in this positive mindset so the other
place is longevity insider. org I love
it yeah dude thank you so much for
coming on the show it is always so good
spend time with you I love it everybody
read the book life force it's incredible
it will blow your mind what is already
possible and what's coming in the future
and speaking of things it'll blow your
mind if you haven't already be sure to
subscribe and until next time my friends
be legendary take care peace