Kind: captions
Language: en
Pope Francis dies. Claus Schwab resigns
from the WF. China warns people not to
sign trade deals with the US. The
Supreme Court drops a midnight
injunction. Alto and Thomas descent.
Brett Weinstein has a banger take on the
dumb voter problem. Future brings us a
mixed bag, mind controlled hands, drone
delivered grenade upgrades, Google's XR
glasses, and Clue's cheat on everything
stance. Drew, I can't tell what's going
to come first. the disillusion of the
global world order or the ability to
throw back a grenade, a drone delivered
grenade with my robot controlled hand.
Uh oh, it is. If you if you have the
wireless hand, can you like throw it at
the drone? You can like hone in. I hope
so. We're We're getting there. Once they
put the little rocket boosters on the
hand, it is literally only a matter of
time. It's crazy. Anime becoming real
life. Oh man. Well, on a somber note,
and for people who are fans of the
Conclave, it is coming to life in real
life. Uh, Pope Francis died this morning
at 88, April 21st,
2025. Um, it's ironic. He was just
visiting the White House. He had an
event. Was he visiting the White House?
Did he die in the US? No, no, no. J I'm
sorry, JD. He was just visiting with JD
Vance. Yeah, I was going to say, okay.
Uh, JD Vance just went to go visit him.
Um, he had an event at the at his
church, St. Peters, and then he passed
in the evening. um him and the 1.3
billion Catholics across the world mourn
his loss. He was the first Latin
American pope, like somebody not from
like traditionally European countries,
dude. Okay, first of all, I don't know
anything about Pope Francis, so forgive
me that I don't have a lot to add.
Certainly sad when anybody dies. I have
no idea if I'm for or against what he
stands for, but I will say that what the
Catholics did in terms of spreading
their religion is brilliant. the whole
no um birth control very smart like when
I hear about religions where they have
like a thing where you can't get people
in from the outside um it's just like if
you want your religion to grow you need
a way to
farm aance I mean I don't know what
other word to use like you gota you got
to be out there like getting people on
your team and the Catholics have done an
amazing job of that they've also done an
amazing job of accumulating ating
wealth. So, hey, they've uh they've got
a lot going for them. I have to bring
the movie back up cuz literally last
year's Oscar winner for best writing was
Conclave. Yeah. And it was about what
happens when a pope dies and they have
to have like a joint conclave, a
conference of all the popes to decide it
all the not popes, cardinals or I'm
sorry, all the cardinals. Yeah. Um, the
thing to add to your point is that there
was a table from people from Africa, a
table from people from South America, a
table from people from the Middle East,
and you just see this rainbow coalition
of Catholics from all around the globe
all vying for like this one. Catholics
still don't play, man. They they really
went to get people on the team. So, it's
literally every grotesque horrors
throughout history. Let's be very clear
about uh how they did it. Uh, when
Columbus came to America, that was I'm
now asking, was that about Catholics?
It was certainly about Christianity. I
just don't know if it was specifically
No, that I thought that was the um
Spanish uh he made the barter with the
Spanish queen to get more resources. So,
they were trying to shortcut Indian.
Yes. But like a big thing of it was,
"Hey, don't worry. I'm going to go back
and I'm going to spread the word of Oh,
after like it was Catholics." So, we'll
have to look that up. In fact, we should
look that up right now. Was Columbus
Catholic? Yes. Another achievement that
the Columbus is awarded is the spread of
Christianity. More specifically, the
spread of Catholicism. There we go, man.
I'm telling you, like pretty grotesque
some of the things they did, but a
definite win if you're just trying to
get numbers on the side. So, shout out.
Uh, in fact, there is a book, I think we
talked about this briefly before, called
1493.
1493 excuse me uh 1493 by Charles C man
which chronicles what a watershed moment
um Columbus coming to the Americas was
not for the reasons that we have
historically celebrated him but for the
fact that he basically introduced the
terraforming of planet earth turning it
into one homogeneous thing it's crazy
there are things in that book I had no
idea like um the bringing over of
earthworms was like radical in terms of
what it did to the soil, uh the
different plants that are now grown all
over the world, like potatoes, which we
think of, at least in an American
context, we think a lot about the um
Irish potato famine. And it wasn't until
long after that that potatoes even made
their way to Ireland, and so that it
becomes the number one crop. It's crazy.
So, all kinds of fascinating things that
happen as you try to spread religion,
try to increase trade, which was
Columbus's whole thing is, hey, I can
find a quick way to I think he was
specifically aiming at
China. Whoops. But we certainly found
the Caribbean. So, there's that. There
is that. Um, well, in the middle of the
night on this long weekend, the Supreme
Court was up working. They did a
emergency injunction um that blocked the
deportation of Venezuelans that were
being held in Texas. This is on the back
of the El Salvador case with Kilmar
Garcia. Some people are saying they're
doing this so that way the same thing
didn't happen, but this is uh straight
from the court's mouth. I'll read the uh
notice right now. This is the order in
pending case. Again, this is a temporary
injunction, just something so they can
freeze the deportations now, but there
needs to be a more formal process in the
future to solidify. There is before the
court an application on behalf of a
puditive class of detainees seeking an
injunction against their removal under
the Alien Enemies Act. This matter is
currently pending before the fifth
circuit. Upon action by the fifth
circuit, the solicitor general is
invited to file a response to the
application before this court as soon as
possible. The government is directed not
to remove any member of the puditive
class of detainees from the United
States until further order of this
court. See legal jargon. Legal jargon.
Legal jargon. Justice Thomas and Justice
Alo descent from the court's order.
Statement from Justice Alo to follow. He
did release a fivepage statement after
that kind of going through the bullet
points of where they got wrong
summarizing this at a very high level.
He thought it it was breaking precedent
being one a midnight uh injunction. This
was before the lower courts had an
opportunity to respond especially on a
holiday weekend. They send a request in
the afternoon on Good Friday and they
expected an answer, you know, an hour or
two back later. Um, so there were just
some things that weren't normally done
in this way that were done for the
specific case. I would argue, now this
is Andrew speaking, they wanted to avoid
what happened with Kilar Garcia and
another mass of people just getting
shipped out before they can do something
and then it' be out of their hands
again. I think it's your take on I think
it's slightly different than that. So
um, this to me is a battle about due
process. This is certainly a political
battle happening within the um within
Scotas uh in terms of what is the right
tension between the different branches
of government, how strong should the
executive be. Uh so it is going to be
very interesting to see all of this play
out. So um I am prepared
to whenever I encounter something where
I don't have the same intuitive read as
what's happening uh I fall back on okay
what are the the um principles upon
which my thinking is based and I'll ex
unless I'm willing to update one of my
principles I'll live and die by uh the
principle as read. So for me the
principle that I view all of this
through is that you have three branches
of government for a reason. There is
meant to be tension between these
branches of government. Uh that if the
Supreme Court makes a decision then the
play is to say hey we have a Supreme
Court for a reason the Supreme Court has
ruled on this. So if they've given a
temporary injunction and seven of the
nine which is true in this case have
said uh we think that this temporary
injunction makes sense. Cool. Unless I'm
going to dive deep into the weeds and
figure out um for myself what's going
on, I'm perfectly happy to uh say,
"Cool, th this is where we're at." Now,
at the same time, the a big part of the
principle that's playing out here is
you've got a um an executive in the form
of Donald Trump who really wants to push
like the boundaries to find out where
are going to be the lines that we're
going to draw about how far an executive
can go. I can feel things ratcheting up
from the perspective of EOS that the
president has um used. And I'm pretty
sure though we should ask chat and get
this mapped out. I'm pretty sure that
over the last several presidents that
the number has gone up and up and up and
certainly the tenacity with which Trump
is
um pushing things. I'll try to keep my
language as neutral as possible. uh
feels emotion emotion feels
unprecedented. Uh and so through Trump's
term, I think that we're going to get a
lot of precedent being established
around what the president can and can't
do. Uh and so right now they're saying,
"Listen, you've been claiming this 90
victory um in the case of these
deportations. You've been saying as if
we came down on your side, dear
president, and uh as the dissenting
opinion signed by three of the justices
uh and penned by Sodomayor made clear,
you are not representing the way that we
think about this. And so um I think that
this midnight
um statement, temporary injunction, was
really about him going around trumpeting
that, oh, this was a victory on my side.
And when you actually read the order,
it's all about there is due process. Due
process was not followed. He should not
be doing this. And in the decision here
or excuse me in the dissenting opinion
here uh what you have from Alo is him
saying Trump is needs to act in
accordance with the Supreme Court
decision that we put down and the
Supreme Court justices need to follow um
the precedent that's been set in terms
of how this process is meant to work.
And so that feels like the right take to
me. Now again, when something is out of
step with my intuitions, I'm perfectly
happy to say I I as a citizen of the
United States am obviously held
accountable to uh what the Supreme Court
decides. So I would be from that
principled perspective. I don't want to
see Trump try to constantly overstep
these things. Uh you need to push by all
means, but within the bounds of the way
that this game is set up. And so while
my intuition is that Alto is correct
here, he was outvoted uh in the
temporary injunction, my hope is that as
the both sides are able to make their
case and this goes through a more formal
process uh that we'll see a reversal of
that, but I'll happily abide by whatever
the Supreme Court decides. Now asking
you as for your personal opinion on
this. Do you think that there is a line
where whether it's terrorism, whether
it's unprotected group, but is it okay
for due process to be revoked in certain
capacities or do you I think that there
needs to be a clear legal precedent and
that whatever you're doing needs to
operate within that legal precedent. So
I don't know the precedent well enough
to know like hey are there times like
there's clearly going to be if a war is
declared there's going to be um the law
will apply differently in those times.
The enemies act alien enemies act
clearly gives another caveat and the
whole debate is going to be about
whether this qualifies or not. So um uh
there there is a process by which new
precedent is set and if new precedent
gets set here it is what it is. What
what I believe is yes there should be
caveats those caveats should be entered
into with the utmost um se like it
should only be in very severe cases and
so when I look at what was happening
with the southern border that was
grotesque. I think that that really sets
us up for something deeply problematic
in terms of if you look at what happened
on 911, this was whatever 19 people that
crossed over the southern border. It's
already been used for that. So, this
isn't like me uh reaching into like I
can't even imagine. It's never happened
before, but it's going to happen this
time. I'm saying this has already
happened. The largest terror attack on
US soil um was committed by people that
came across the southern border. So, I
have no reason to believe in a time of
greatly increased um international
tensions, I'm speaking specifically of
China here, that I wouldn't think that
that's going to be used to bring people
across the border. So, I think that you
do have an issue. I think that you need
to um find a solution
to protect yourself not only from future
in um incursions, that feels like a
loaded word, but future um illegal
crossings of the border where people
could take advantage of that. You need
to protect that. I think Trump has done
a good job of that. But you also have to
deal with the fact that some number that
people are clocking somewhere between 10
and 30 million people that came in
illegally. Bro, it does not have to be a
big percentage of bad apples before you
have a real problem when you're talking
about that many people. Setting aside
the permanent blue uh state hypothesis
that Elon has pushed, just are you going
to have bad actors? And the answer to me
is obviously yes.
Okay. Having said all of that, you can't
just I think it would be unwise. It
would be unwise to just get rid of due
process.
So, this is the process that needs to
play out. You need to go through the
Supreme Court. I get why as the
president, he's going to push the
boundaries. But I also like I don't want
to hear language about uh we've got to
get rid of these guys and get some
people that know what they're doing
inside. That's somebody that doesn't
respect that tension. And I want the
tension. I don't assume myself to always
be right. I don't assume anybody to
always be right. And so, you have to at
some point rely on the systems. Mhm. Um,
and this is the system.
Yeah, it's it's a tricky situation cuz
there's still a lot more cases of
pending people to your point that there
were millions of people coming in over
the border for the last four years. This
is the hard one for me. So JD Vance was
like, listen, you've overwhelmed the
system. My intuition is yes, that's the
right take. Obviously, the Supreme Court
came out and said, nope, like you need
uh due process. We like have a a way
that this works, and you guys are
flouting that.
And yet both of those things strike me
as true that there are too many people
and you are now de facto saying um
they're here and they're going to stay
here. And so again, this goes against my
intuition of the right way to handle
this. Um but this is precisely why we
have the government the way that we have
it is no one person could be trusted to
make these decisions and be right all
the time. I don't want to live in a
dictatorship. I wouldn't want to be the
dictator. Uh, so again, while I hope
that I
um if I were really trying to make a
case for this, I hope that I could make
a compelling case, but I wouldn't
necessarily want to convince people. I
would just want to have my arguments uh
be one of the things that gets debated.
And this gets right into Brett
Weinstein's what I think is a W take uh
from the whole Joe Rogan, Dave Smith
versus uh um Douglas Murray, which just
continues to have legs. It's uh it's
crazy. I think that this is really a
flash point for us as a
society. Obviously, I call this the dumb
voter
[Music]
problem. What do we do when people are
too dumb to think well through a
problem? Uh, if we can, let's play the
Brett Weinstein clip because I think I I
just cannot believe that people take any
stance other than what Brett is about to
say. The mechanism by which we
discovered it is wellnown. It is the
exact thing that the founders of this
great country put first on the list of
our enumerated rights for a goddamn
reason. It was they couldn't name a
podcast. They couldn't have called out
Joe Rogan, but they came as close as
they could come to saying, "Sorry,
there's no source of highquality
information versus lowquality
information, malinformation,
disinformation." You can't know ahead of
time. The mechanism by which you come to
understand what is true,
Douglas, is discussion. It is discussion
in which nobody gets to set the rules
about what kinds of opinions can be
investigated. And yes, that does cause
some garbage stuff to be said. But what
reveals that it's garbage stuff? Free
and open inquiry that reveals that
actually it doesn't stand up to
scrutiny. That's how you do it.
Constantine Kesson, I don't know what's
wrong with these people. It's really
like somebody has figured out how to
threaten them into saying things that
they full well know aren't true. They're
becoming what they were fighting
against. They they are becoming what
they were fighting against. And I must
say in both of those cases, I feel like
I don't think I was duped to begin with
that they actually held free speech as a
high value. So the fact that they are
backing away from it and calling for
some kind of standard self-imposed or
otherwise to prevent certain you know
the fact is heterodoxy is heterodoxy and
it often sounds crazy and most of it is
but the good stuff is the stuff that
sounds crazy that then does strangely
stand up to scrutiny. That's how you
figure out what's coming is you look at
the heterodox stuff and you figure out
what has predictive power. And you can't
get around that. and the people who
tried failed.
Oh god, that's such a good take. Uh that
that's it. Like to me that is exactly
how people should be looking at this.
Now if I were going to um mind readad
Douglas Murray for a second because he's
going to say, "God damn it, how many
times did I have to say he is perfectly
within his rights to talk about this
subject?" Uh
however, being somebody who's actually
gone there, being somebody who is
actually an expert on this topic, a
somebody who's willing to take on the
mantle of I am an expert about this, you
need to have a balance of those. So
fine, Joe Rogan, if you want to have
people that come on here and spout off
uh what he considers nonsense, then you
need to have a counterveiling voice of
people that are that are experts that
have been there. I understand the desire
to have people have that fully balanced
take. I don't think that's the right
play. I I don't think getting in a twist
about that not happening is the right
place to spend mental energy. that is a
better way to say it. I think the
reality is that ultimately the onus is
on the end user to make a decision about
the world that they live in and they are
going to have to do that hard work and I
completely understand that not everybody
is going to be perceived as being able
to do that. However, you just have to
allow them to otherwise you get into the
authoritarian top down rule. Who gets to
make that decision? But it is admittedly
jarring for me to hear some of the
voices that um and this does not make me
lose respect for them by any means, but
it is such a weird take for me that
you've got so many people that are like,
"Yeah, freedom of speech is like
dopeish, I guess, but like we ultimately
do need this elite class to parse
through this information and to hand it
to people." And I'm just like, god damn.
I get it. We live in the social media
age where historically speaking, bad
ideas would die in the vine. They just
would never be able to get the kind of
traction that they're able to get now.
Uh you just have to be willing to fight
in the court of public opinion and you
have to let this stuff come out in the
wash over time. Mhm. And otherwise you
get co man. You get these acute periods
where the lunacy of I know what's best
for you and therefore shut up and listen
and let me do my thing actually keeps
people locked in their house for god
knows how long. I it's just really
bananas. And almost on queue. Hillary
Clinton was just talking about this over
the weekend with Rachel Mano u with a
one-on-one interview and boosting Trump
back in 2016. But I also think there are
Americans who are uh engaged in uh this
kind of propaganda uh and whether they
should be civily or even in some cases
criminally charged uh is something that
would be a better deterrence than
boosting Trump back in 2016. I mean she
used the word propaganda. So what do you
think these elite class what are people
worried about that they're willing to
take away the number one like right that
was given to us on the constitution?
Like what are they trying to lose
control? losing control. They are trying
to protect against losing control. Okay,
that's the bumper sticker. Now, going
more deeply.
People believe they're right. People do
not have a healthy distrust for
themselves. People think that because
they feel something, it is real. People
confuse beliefs and values with
objective truth. So you put all of that
together, they believe that the feelings
that they have are predicated on an
accurate reading of the situation based
on what they believe to be true about
the world, based on how the world ought
to be that they also believe is um in
some cases literally handed to them on a
stone tablet by God him or herself. And
it's just like what do you do with that?
Like at each one of those points, you
have the potential for um I'm right. I
know I'm right and everybody needs to
fall in line. And when you realize, and
this is where I think good people
derail, when you realize that you really
are smarter than a lot of people and you
really do have way higher predictive
beliefs and that person's life really
would be better off if they would listen
to you. The number of times, dude, that
I've felt that in my life where I'm
like, "All this person needs to do is
just listen to everything I say and do
what I tell them to do and their life
will be better." and and like I really
believe it like this person's life would
be so much better if they would just do
what I say, Drew. And yet in the face of
all that, life has just taught me one
immutable
truth. I'm often wrong and I never see
it coming. It's always the thing like I
think about this a lot with the economy.
I know that five years from now I'm
going to look back on the way that I
think about the economy now and be like,
"Ah, that was stupid." And so, but that
doesn't stop me from feeling right. That
doesn't stop me from believing the world
really should do what I say right now
and that the world would really be
better off.
But because I try to actually learn my
lessons and learn the lessons from
history of other people, I just go, nah,
I want to be convincing. I don't
necessarily want to convince everybody.
I want people to have my sort of AI take
on like this is how I see things and I
want them to go yeah I'm going to need
like 50 other voices and I'm going to
synthesize and then add my voice to the
mix and then over time we're going to
see what are the things that have the
highest predictive validity but h
everybody's wrong. I've never looked at
anybody and been like wow you're right
about everything. So I just don't
understand the impulse for people to not
recognize I should not be just blanket
trusted. I don't get it.
I I I just don't understand the root of
it is because it seems like it always
comes down to a control thing and I want
it to be I want it to be like the
Supreme Court thing like okay maybe I'm
missing a certain like information topic
that will like unlock them like okay I
get what they're thinking but when I
think about Douglas Murray when I think
about Hillary I get to the same point of
just like no you just want the people
who you designate as the right ones to
listen to to be the right ones to listen
to. I don't see anything other than
that. I mean, so, okay, let's really go
now a layer deeper into the real real
messiness. Uh, there really are better
ideas and worse ideas. And some ideas
are going to be better for humanity.
Some are going to be worse. Some are
going to be better for the individuals.
Some are going to be worse. And so, what
you have are elite people that are like,
"Yeah, look, I get it. I'm wrong
sometimes, but holy Jesus, I'm right way
more than these other fools." And so, if
we listen to these other fools, then
life is going to be worse. And I'm
looking at my kids and I'm like, I don't
want these guys who have a worse track
record than me. Even though I'm not
perfect. They have a worse track record
than me. And so I don't want them to
win. Literally, I'm not even necessarily
thinking of myself, though. Of course,
human motivations are very complex. But
let's just give them that like, cool,
this isn't about you. You're not trying
to make more money. You're not trying to
power grab for the sake of power. You're
literally looking at your children and
you're like, I want their lives to be
better. and you're like,
"Uh, I get this right way more
frequently than the next person, and
therefore we should listen to me." And
they're not wrong. Yeah. And yet you, I
think, need to build a system where you
fully understand that the system has to
protect itself from people like me who
are just convinced that they're right,
but some percentage of the time will be
wrong. And you have to have enough
solidity in the system that it can move
forward, right? Like uh America is not
uh despite Michael Malice's desire, we
are not anarchctic. So there is uh some
solidity to the system. There is
process. There is a constitution. There
are three branches of government etc.
etc. Yeah. and I think to our
advantage.
But
nonetheless, you have to be willing
to you have to want in my opinion ideas
to battle it out. And that never is
there uh multiply or put on something
because it comes from an elite point of
view. Seems like this discussion is
growing. Um now that Hillary's has
thrown her hat in the ring. just see
this kind of rippling into something
larger, especially with the next midterm
elections coming up, the next
presidential election. It's going to be
the war on information is by no means
getting any quieter. Nope. We'll get
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get back to the show. In international
news, Claus Schwab has resigned from the
WF effective immediately. Um there's
still been some speculation. A lot of
people are just like he's 80. He started
the organization. I think he's even
older than that. He's 87 if I'm not
mistaken. Yeah. So he's
um he's been there since the day one. Um
so a lot of people there isn't hasn't
been much. Just he's stepping on and
moving on to other things. Um he's
famous for that quote, you'll own
nothing and you'll like it and you'll be
happy. And you'll be happy. Yeah, I
think anyway. I think I'm pretty sure
that's a quote. Uh yeah, Claus Schwab.
So, um not somebody that I have a deep
background in, but uh I know enough to
know that the World Economic Forum is
losing in the battle of public opinion.
Uh and so if I'm inside of that
organization and I'm like, "Listen,
Claus, thank you, brother, for getting
us here." Oh god, what was that? I I
have no idea what is wrong with your
feed. I'm on I'm I'm under this post.
But let me tell you, there going to be a
difference, dude. You learn so much
about somebody by what the feed surface
that is. I get everything about that.
You're going to have to show people
this. Oh god, you don't. Is that What is
happening? Is that him? I No. Get out of
here. Is that AI though? Jesus.
This is Oh, good. Zoom in. Oh my god.
That doesn't look like AI. No. Come on,
bro. That is horrifying. All right. For
anybody that is just listening at home,
oh boy, the feed on X under this post
about our boy Klouse resigning, it shows
him on a nude beach wearing like lace.
Oh, wow. AI is coming for us all, boys
and girls. Good lord. Okay. Well, I
don't know if I'm recommending that you
look at that. You kind of need to, but
at the same time, that is distressing.
Um, okay. So, uh, back to the issue at
hand. Uh, if I'm inside the
organization, yes, I'm going to be like,
"Okay, we've got to get this going
again. If we want to get people on our
side, we're going to need new
leadership." I'm going to guess that
they're going to go for somebody
younger. I don't know how much younger.
We'll see if they're going to be in full
gerontocracy mode or if they can
actually get somebody in their 40s. Uh,
that's probably a better play.
But yeah, you uh you go after the sick
and the weak, Drew. And I think that
despite him saying, "Well, my 88th
birthday was about to hit and I just
want to go chill." I guess, uh, I don't
buy that. This happens. People don't
give up power willingly,
even when they're 88. Listen, as I said
that, uh, Ray Dallio certainly came to
mind because he seemed to work very,
very hard uh, to find a successor. It's
rare. It's rare. It's possible that he
just wants to go be a grandpa, but um,
my gut instinct is that there's it's it
was so abrupt. My gut instinct is the
abruptness of the resignation tells you
a lot more than his age. No, 100%. Um,
I'm literally looking at Google Gemini
right now to see kind of what of the
highlights WF does shaping global
agendas, research and insight
development, collaboration,
partnerships. So, this is a facilitation
mechanism for the entire world and the
they're a group of elites that get
together and say, "How are we all going
to think?" Yeah. As far as I can tell,
that's really what's going on. Um,
so curious to see who's the next uh
leader of that group of elites. We shall
see what's going to be their next agenda
item. That's what I really want to know.
Well, China has a new agenda item and
it's telling other people, don't mess
with the US. Yeah. Um, if you strike
trade deals, there will be consequences.
So
breaking news this morning, China is
warning other countries from making any
trade deals with the United States as
countries like Japan and South Korea
have begun negotiations with the Trump
administration. China's Commerce
Ministry releasing a statement saying
quote, "China firmly opposes any party
reaching a deal at the expense of
China's interest. If this happens, China
will never accept it and it will
resolutely take counter measures in a
reciprocal manner. China is determined
and capable of safeguarding its own
rights and interests. So, this seems
like China is pulling a US that if you
want to sign with the US, we're going to
start a trade war with everybody, too.
Is this just a are we spiraling to the
bottom? It doesn't strong men get a
strong man. It's just like this is this
is the rhetoric. So, you posture, you
bark, and you hope you don't have to
bite. We'll see, man. Look, this is
there is now a lobe of my brain
dedicated entirely to what's going on
with the USChina relation. Uh I do not
want to create a um fake monster out of
China. I grew up in the 80s where Russia
was just the bad guy and we were not
looking realistically at this is a
nation full of people that love and want
to do uh interesting things in their
life. And China is exactly the same.
Just as I don't want anybody on the
global market to assume that uh America
is some big hegeimon and that we're just
some political animal like we are all
also just a bunch of people trying to do
cool things in our lives trying to love
trying to uh have fun and push our own
skills and abilities and all of that
stuff. So, I don't want to make a
caricature of China. At the same time,
man, especially having lived through a
cold war, like I can feel the vibes as
we're um building towards this and there
are definitely steps that we have to
take as a country to protect ourselves
uh economically, protect ourselves
militarily. And so, to pretend like this
isn't uh we're the two big fighters, the
two heavyweights that are going to end
up on the same card uh that are on the
same card, man. And so the question is
like what's this going to be? Is this
going to be purely economic? Um will we
find ways to coexist? Are we going to um
divvy up the world in a way that is
um reasonable? Are we going to really go
to blows over this? And World War II was
um significantly larger in death toll
than World War I. God forbid we find
ourselves in World War II. The death
toll would be a grotesque exaggeration
of the death toll of World War II, which
is like 55 million people, by the way.
Uh, so this is not a game we want to
play and I don't
know I don't know how we back out of
this. And so I will think largely about
how we talk about it, how we cover it.
Um,
and avoiding a caricature I think is
step number one. So there I think there
are things around China to be inspired
by. I think there are things that they
are doing have done. In terms of output,
I absolutely despise authoritarian top
down rule. I don't think I've made any
qualms about that. Um but at the same
time, some of the things that they've
created are extraordinary. Like when I
look at the vibrancy of just the
physical architecture of China, it's far
more impressive than what we're doing in
the US. Like honestly, even this isn't
entirely true. Manhattan's got some cool
things going for it. LA, not at all. Uh,
but when you and I, hey, Douglas Murray,
I have not been to China. So, uh, with
one exception of, uh, Hong Kong, which
depending on how you take that, only the
airport. Uh,
so from what I've seen there, they've
done some pretty spectacular things from
an entertainment standpoint. Even there,
man, I'm pretty blown away by what
they're doing on the anime front terms
of blending 2D and 3D animation. uh for
anybody that uh follows us on the lives
that's an area of like real deep passion
for me. Um and they're clearly like
there is a vitality to them from uh an
output perspective. Now I never know
what to believe in terms of their
economy. Are they are we putting them in
just absolute dire straits? Were they
already in a difficult place given the
housing bubble that they had created?
Um, and it's entirely possible that
they're in a very weak position right
now and that this is all going to play
out to the US's advantage, but I live by
the axiom that things are never as good
as you hope they will be and they're
never as bad as you fear they will be.
So, uh, I doubt this is going to play
out super clean. Like, America wins,
China loses. It's not going to be like
that. So, uh, this is an incredibly
disruptive moment. I want to see. In
fact, Drew, if I can sum all of this up
and say this, dear America, I love you
so much. Dear young people, especially
um play big. Like internally, I'm not
saying focus on beating China. I'm just
saying do rad [ __ ] Like this is such an
incredible moment where AI is going to
unlock all of your creativity. You're
going to have so few things that stop
you from doing something incredible. Do
something incredible. like believe that
you can create, want the competition, um
hunger to go on the playing field and
risk losing. Fine. Accept that not
everybody is going to end up in the same
position. It is what it is, but play to
win. And so, the one thing that I hope
comes out of what feels like such a
wakeup call for me as a Gen Xer growing
up, man, was like, "Hey, the world
doesn't owe you [ __ ] get out there.
You're gonna get kicked in the face.
You're gonna get broken. And some of us
get stronger in the broken areas. I
mean, just like that was the ethos, man.
Like, get out there. You live in the
land of the free. You can do anything
you set your mind to. Like, get after
it. And I don't feel that same energy.
And so I don't want to see us turn into
a gerontocracy simply continue to be a
gerontocracy simply because the only
people that are trying to play to win
are old people because that's how we
were raised. Like that would be so
[ __ ] distressing. And I remember when
in fact I am putting this idea together
right now. When Eric Weinstein first
said basically that the boomers need to
give up power to I would assume he was
talking millennials. I was like uh
that's not how this game works. like
power is wrestled away from the people
that have it. And it is entirely
possible that the reason they've been
able to hold on to power for so long is
not only the economic woes that we have
put on the younger generation. It is
just the lack of energy to [ __ ] play
to win, man. To like get out there and
be like, "You guys are old, you are
slow, and I'm going to take this away
from you because I'm of the moment.
Like, I have the youth. I have the
energy. I have the lack of scar tissue.
Yeah, I've been thinking about this a
lot. Uh
I old people should never be able to
stop young people. It should be
impossible. Yeah. And the fact that
right now it's possible. It it Drew it
shouldn't be possible. Like I should not
be able to put uh a negative enough
economic situation on you that you just
give
up. So what does that say that people
are giving up? like what what's the cure
might be a strong word but how do you
break people from that cuz there are a
lot of people who are young who are at
the top of their potential who are
deciding to call it quits I think it was
like 20% of young people are falling are
not in education not in training not
looking for work like they're they're
part of the unemployment rate that we
don't count as part of the unemployment
rate because they're kind of already off
the board so what do you say to this
younger generation that doesn't have
that 80s hushba
raise your young men to be
loving,
protectionoriented
savages. And we did multiple generations
of dirty on that. And I want them to be
loving. I want them to think I want to
protect my family. I want to protect my
community. I I want them to have that
orientation. But you you've got to
unlock that inner savage. And we've done
everything to drug it, to numb it, uh to
shame it, and we're now paying the
consequences,
man. And speaking of China, they got a
drone grenade launcher. Like, this is
getting crazy, man. These future tech
weapons, I can't even I can't even. It
looks like Listen to the music being
played on this, dude. This is like, hey,
we've got a grenade just for you.
Uh, and this grenade launcher has the
ability to carry things. It can also be
folded up and put inside of a grenade
launcher to be shot out. It could be
mounted. Um, they were showing different
use case scenarios of it flying indoors,
dude. Anybody that's not looking at
this, uh, you've got a little drone that
can carry u multiple times its weight,
which is already shocking. Uh, so you
could load it with three grenades, I
think was a pitch. There's no subtitles
to this, so I'm sort of taking the
poster's word for it. But it shows it
going inside, identifying a man in the
distance that's uh running away from it,
being like, "Yo, got you." And this is
this is terrifying. So, this is why you
don't want things to go kinetic, man.
This is uh this is not going to be a fun
game. Uh obviously, this is already
playing out right now in the Russia
Ukraine war. We've all seen plenty of
footage of this, but uh these are now
getting dramatically improved. War and
pornography just make all kinds of
improvements and unfortunately these are
not always improvements that we want to
see. So yeah, don't love this man, but
you're going to see more and more and
more of this. Clue Lee is out. Cheat on
everything. This is my first time
watching this. I need to Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
So, uh, how old did you say you were?
Um, I'm I'm I'm 30. 30 years old.
Um, your profile says you worked at Ban
Amazon. Uh, yeah. Yeah. I've been there
for the uh past 8 years doing um like
senior software engineering. So, coding.
Really? You look I I know I look a
little young for my age, but um I
promise you I'm I'm 30 years old. Okay.
Well, maybe you are just way older than
you look.
I found your profile backyard. You're
like into art. Yeah.
This is hilarious. This is hilarious.
Oh, man.
The uh the fact that people will be able
to get
data. I'm pretty sure there's from their
um their glasses like real time. this is
what's happening. Feedback, AI
assistance.
We are going to live in that world. Like
this is not some future thing. Uh Google
XR has already announced glasses that
are theoretically going to come out in
2026 that do literally exactly what Clue
is showing in that commercial. This is
our present. This isn't our future. So,
I'll be very interested to see what
happens with all this. Now, as somebody
who's just an absolute freak for this
kind of
technology, partly because I'm good at
navigating my own life, um meaning if I
saw that this were diminishing my
relationships, then I would know to take
the glasses off and make sure that I'm
building a relationship that doesn't
have that. I don't know that this is
going to be negative, but this is going
to be a real thing. And so, um, we're
going to have to remap like what we
think about how to measure like
somebody's personality, how to measure
their level of intelligence, like all
things that you're going to cue off of
in I mean, and this is a dating
relationship, but as an employee, like
all the things like it is uh it is
utterly fascinating, but I spend so much
of my time on the weekends engaging with
AI. It's powerful. I think a lot of
times we talk about the meaning crisis
that AI and future tech is going to
bring, but to me it's almost like at
right now it seems like it's more like a
utility crisis because it's like we have
all these tools at our disposal and how
do we make sure that we're using all
these tools for action versus inaction
versus pleasure chasing versus like
collapsing into ourselves.
Well, uh, so given what has happened
with social media, a big part of this is
going to be how early do you introduce
these? Uh, with anything new like this,
admittedly, with glasses, I would be
hesitant to let my kids wear the
glasses. I would want them to be tutored
by AI for sure, but I would also want
them to be able to navigate the world.
Well, I think I've talked about this
before on the show, but my dad used to
make us, even though calculators existed
and all that stuff. Uh, when we were at
the store, my dad would make us try to
beat the person at the cash register,
uh, for how much change we were going to
owe them. So, the total would come up
and before, you know, like if I was
going to give them a $20 bill or
whatever and it was like $14.92,
uh we were supposed to run the
calculation in our head like this is how
much I'm owed and things like that that
my parents were constantly doing to help
us figure out how to navigate the world.
Even though there are devices that can
do that work for us, they wanted us to
have the intellectual capability to deal
with it. I think there's going to be
some amount of that. You don't want to
deny your kids like AI is just way too
powerful. You want your kids being
taught by AI. You want them engaging
with AI. You want them to have AI
fluency. Just this morning, um I was
coding an app to allow myself to track
my um anime viewing and manga reading.
And I was like, this is absolutely
insane to vibe code and it just exists.
And like, oh, this part's broken. And
you don't tell the AI how to fix it. You
just go, it's broken. And it's like, say
last fam, I got you. goes in, figures
out how it's broken, it fixes it. There
was something so crazy to me about that.
Absolutely fascinating. Now, you were
talking for a while about the um working
out app that you were building, but you
don't talk about it anymore. So, I'm
guessing you ran up against a
limitation. I hit a wall. So, the wall
that I got was the scale aspect of it.
It's very specific to me. Um and I have
a offline version. Do you use it? Um I
got there. It's this is okay. This I
think is very this this is the making
clear where we're at. Yeah. This is the
utility part of it aspect because it's
like I was able to build it and the idea
and the concept was basically gamifying
workout tracking your meals and stuff
like that kind of modeled in like a game
like a gaming way. Um so I built it
works offline on my phone but I didn't
think about like the protocols and the
necessary backend things to make it like
live on the app store. So, right now
it's like a dev version on my Android,
which is good, but I only have like four
pages. It doesn't update like
automatically. I have to manually add
like more screens and stuff. My nephew
is like literally a computer scientist.
So, I'm like, "Okay, hey bro, here's a
halfbroken code. Can you help me parse
through it?" So, he's now saying, "Okay,
you need to put this over here. You need
to put this right here. This how it
needs to launch." And then from there,
we can then put it in AI to get the
final like output. So that's what like
the last two weeks have been of like I'd
be very interested now that Google has
launched codebase I believe Firebase.
Firebase excuse me. Um to see how much
farther it can push it because here's
the thing I want people to zoom in on.
If you find yourself allowing yourself
to say things like AI is not there yet,
like this is trash. Zoom in on the word
yet. Because if it's true that this
stuff is advancing 300% yearover-year
with no signs of stopping,
Dude, that every day is almost a
percentage point improvement, which
means uh in 10 days it's 10% better.
Yeah, that's crazy. In a 100 days, it's
almost 100% better. So, it is uh by the
end of this year, the kinds of leaps and
bounds I think that we're going to see
are going to be bananas. And so, I get
it. We're hitting a wall right now for
sure. The same is true. Like, I am so
desperately trying to use it for uh
creating comic books and anime. Uh, and
you hit a wall and you hit a wall very
fast. But I'm like, when I think back to
where we were two years ago, I'm like,
holy lord, like we have come so far, so
fast that where are we going to be in 18
months? It's just going to keep getting
better. It seems like we just have to
hit like that precipice that like once
we cross that certain corner, then it's
like boom, we shoot for it. So, no
doubt. It's all it's already getting so
good that every weekend I find myself
going, "Okay, when do we start investing
in like we're now just an AI animation
house?" Like that's what we do because
right now we're still pushing some of
our traditional stuff forward, seeking
funding, blah blah blah. But it's like I
don't that's not long for this world.
Like I don't think it's on our docket,
but we should talk about the Ryan
Cougler uh deal that he just got with
Warner Brothers. Yeah. Um very
fascinating. After 25 years, I think the
IP reverts back to him. He gets a big
chunk of the box office and the question
becomes why would Warner Brothers ever
agree to a deal like that? And they'll
agree to a deal like that because of
what is happening with AI. These guys
are not dumb. They understand that they
are in an existential crisis. Streaming
fired the shot that caused them to be
bleeding out. But now to have that
followed up with uh AI, it's just the
the game is going to be over
because where would I take it? Three
years from now, probably three years
from now, you will be able to um I don't
I don't know if you'll ever never say
never. I don't know if it's in the very
short term that you'll be able to just
single prompt a oneshot thing and then
you love it. I think it's always going
to need refine, refine, refine, refine.
But the ability to refine in what people
think of as vibe coding, that I think is
going to be very real. And so you'll
pull up an image and you'll just be
like, "No, not like that. Change this.
Change this aspect of it." And then
you'll be like, "Cool, I got it."
Because that's a big thing. Like right
now when I'm trying to create a
character, I'll like, "Okay, I love
everything about it but the hands." And
then when you go to do something with
the hands, it changes everything just
enough that it breaks what you liked
about it. So it becomes this sort of
infuriating loop of like, "Stop changing
the things that I already like." I think
they'll be able to do that very, very
well. Uh
so if you can do that in the next 3
years, you've like what does Netflix
become? Becomes YouTube. Yeah. And so
now it's just it is an entire universe
of user generated content. I think a lot
about this with the video game stuff.
How do you facilitate the users creating
within your container their own game
experience because that's what
everything is going to be. Um
yeah, don't don't uh I feel like we're
seeing that now though. If you look at
like Roblox, Fortnite, like even
Minecraft, you go to this world to use
these shapes and these patterns and
these colors to then create the game and
this exopic environment you want. It is
still right now and they're on the right
path. These guys clearly see the right
future. I want to be very clear. Let
them have all their flowers. M. However,
there is a big difference between it's a
developer class fighting for the
attention of all of these um players
versus YouTube where you've got a guy on
his phone who makes a video that 72
people will ever see and that's it. And
there's some ungodly long tale of like,
oh, I just needed a video for that
specific thing and I watched it. We're
going to get these hyper niche
communities. Now, why does this matter?
Because when you think about the modern
world as we know it is the answer to
what does it look like when you can
effectively aggregate capital. So you
look at a skyscraper that is aggregated
capital. That's somebody who goes to a
bank or uh a consortium and gets a huge
amount of money to build something like
that. But we live in a world where you
have all these gigantic companies,
buildings, bridges, whether they're
aggregating tax dollars or they're
aggregating investment dollars or what
have you. But you're living in a world
of aggregated capital. What AI is going
to bring is a world of disagregated
capital because everybody's going to be
able to have their niche thing. Mhm. And
I don't know, certainly in the world of
entertainment, I don't know how you will
ever need to aggregate capital, which
means that you no longer have these big
companies, which means it will be very
hard to get the whole world to pay
attention to something at the same time.
Now, when you look at X, there's a lot
of things trending, but we're all
downstream of our algorithm. And so what
does the world look like when there is
so much content being created
everywhere? Even in video games, which
traditionally has been so hard to do,
that you were going to get like a ruling
elite at the top. Um, when all of that
goes away, do things get better or
worse? I actually don't know.
The streaming thing was interesting to
me because I feel like the studios
caused their own death by chasing down
what Netflix did. And where Netflix was
able to kind of double down, gain more
attention, double down, gain more
attention. Studios then try to pivot and
kind of copy, which is the studio
system. They see a hit on somewhere else
and they try to copy and emulate it. And
to your point, it has now caused this
like downro spiral where a movie hitting
number one on a box office is now 60
million where a year ago, two years ago,
po pre- pandemic, it was 100, 200, 300
million uh opening weekends. So now that
the theater system is cut away, I do
think fundamentally we are going to
consume content differently. But do you
think we're going to hit like a breaking
point? Cuz at one point there's there's
still 17 popular YouTubers and the other
four million that are striving for one
of those spots. Do you think it's still
g I think there's still going to be
those people at the top or do you think
AI can reshuffle that completely? AI
will reshuffle that completely. Think
about how Mr. Beast has pulled away from
the pack. He's done it because he was
the first to a format or at least the
first to do it well to a format, but
then he was able to build these budgets
up that now like how are you going to
copy him? Like he's giving away $10
million inside of his Amazon show. It's
like that's going to be tough to
replicate until there are no barriers.
You can do whatever the hell you want
because you can create. None of this
stuff costs money to create and so it
literally will. It's just your
imagination because AI will pump it out.
Well, we'll see. In video game news, I
wanted to bring this up to you because
as good was talking about Marathon and
he says that he needs to make sure that
the female characters in the game are
effable. I'll let you hear from him and
then I want to pose this question about
marketing and how we attract like
consumers. I I think that uh pretty much
every single circumstance it's always a
bad idea to make characters that are not
conventionally
attractive because this is again uh this
is a shooter game and shooter games are
going to be primarily played by men. So,
if you're playing if you're making a
shooter game that's primarily made for
men, then you should make sure that all
of the female characters in the game are
[ __ ] And I know this might sound
crazy to say, but I'm just going to say
it. That's what you should do. That's
what you should do because that's what
people want to do. That's what girls
will cosplay. Girls don't want to
cosplay ugly, weird looking,
androgynous, creepy characters and all
of that. Like think about how much
advertising Marvel Rivals gets because
of how many girls try to cosplay the
characters. I I think that uh I don't
get why this is controversial. So uh
here is the reality. We live in the
marketplace of ideas and uh if people
really want characters that are
[ __ ] then create a game with
characters that are [ __ ] and see if
people play it. And if they do, cool.
You found a niche in the market. Go do
your thing. um he is merely from where
I'm sitting he's merely talking about
evolutionary responses and that when you
look at society as averages that men are
attracted to attractive women and
whether they're pixels or not uh if you
see a woman that has a an a posterior
just to not continue to double down on
the naughty words here uh that triggers
that brain response then yeah people are
going to play that so because they want
to look at it it's creat creating the
psychological response, the
neurochemical response that people are
looking for. So, uh, and if not, and if
I'm wrong about that and society has
moved on, then make the game with the,
um, androgynous, weird characters,
whatever you said, and it'll be popular.
So, um, if I were going to make a bet as
a um, builder, I would make the bet more
on the side of let's make sure that
these are conventionally attractive uh,
just because there's more evolutionary
weight behind that. Um, but I don't have
any problem with seeing this play out
where people are voting with their
dollars. So, let people say what they're
going to say. I just the way that my
brain is wired, I do not have a um
emotional response to this. It's like,
cool. Yeah, that makes sense to me. Um,
uh, but people are going to feel some
kind of way about it. I feel like we're
at the intersection right now,
especially where culture, politics is
telling us everybody is beautiful. These
are That's just not true. These are the
standards. No, I'm just But that's
what's being that's the overwhelming
message that we need to accept all
types. We need to be accept like there's
this but then on the marketing side
there's still these very niche uh
responses that they're trying to start
from us. So like Victoria's Secret is
still going to sell sex. Like there is
still little boys are going to be
attracted to women that they idolize
like to Asgo's point. So there are these
you can call them evolutionary
pressures. You can tell I call them
traditionals, traditional pressures that
they work. Like the reason everything is
sexy is because sex sells. It works.
It's proven. Um the reason that the
women are have certain body types and
characters in a lot of these like uh
articles and magazines and movies and
media mediums is because it attracts the
males, that attracts the dollars, that
attracts all these things. So, it's one
of those things of do we rectify that or
is it just like it's if it don't if it's
not broke, don't fix it. The second you
are out of step with evolution, you are
in trouble. Now, the reason that this
persists is because uh you can
manipulate humans. And the younger you
get people, man, the more you can sort
of nudge the things that they find
interesting. I really need to research
this to make sure that it's true. But
I'm going to keep spouting it until I
find contradictory evidence that all
sexual fetishes are formed by the age of
14. And that there's just something
about those early years, the age of
imprinting where like whatever you are
bombarded with, which is why beauty
standards change over time. Whatever
you're bombarded with, you're going to
find attractive. But you have to that
like has to line up with evolution. So
you're not going to be able to at scale,
I don't think, get everybody to be like
people that look like horses. Like
that's the really attractive thing. And
yes, I'm well aware of furries, but I'm
just saying that h that's out of step.
So good luck. You're going to get like a
fringe of people that you might be able
to convince of that, but heavier women,
thinner women, big boobs, big asses,
like that all falls within these are
still signs of fertility. So now what
the culture invests in, hey, cool, like
you can get it to swing one way or the
other within bounds. So I get why people
because they can either intuitively feel
that or they know it intellectually.
It's like they get that you can sort of
sway these things and so they want to
get in the mix and sway it. Um, but at
the same time, if you step out of like
what evolution has just ground into the
development of your brain, good luck.
You're you're really going to struggle.
Do a quick search for me for boy. Young
boy watches belly dancer in
[Music]
awe. I love everything about that. This
is what you're up against. Good luck
beating that. Like no one is telling
that kid find this
[Music]
attractive. His jaw is literally going
to hit the floor in a minute.
Well, there it is, man. Good luck. Good
luck fighting against that. All right,
that's all I got. All right, boys and
girls, speaking of things you should
never fight against, if you haven't
already, be sure to subscribe. And until
next time, my friends, be legendary. If
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