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Language: en
Candace Owens is vindicated over her
claims that Charlie Kirk planned to
split with Israel that's actually now
been backed up by Turning Point
themselves. Steven Miller goes ham over
attacks against ICE uh and the need for
troops in both Chicago and Portland,
whether they're targeting brown people.
New economic data shows we are
hemorrhaging jobs right now. New report
comes out suggesting that Xihinping may
be losing power in China. So, we'll talk
about that.
>> I'm going to be honest. So, as we were
doing some research and things, we were
kind of diving into everything that has
to do with um
>> Candace Owens and Charlie Kirk. And it
really comes down to
>> here Candace Owens again making
outrageous claims.
>> Outlandish.
>> Like, this is just another outrageous
thing. She's going to get sued in 3
weeks and we're going to sweep it under
the rug. I completely written it off.
And then she goes live, I want to say
yesterday, and that's when the receipts
start rolling in. We get confirmations
from Turning Point USA. And it seems, I
don't want to say instantly, but it
seems that the conversation is now
slowly starting to shift a bit and
people are now open on Candace's claim
specifically to Charlie Kirk. Like now
it's a bit more maybe it is more
credible than we thought or wait a
second, how many donors did he lose? How
much money was on the table that he
denied? And now these other kind of
conspiracy theories are coming to light.
What was your first reaction hearing
about it? And then as you were going
through the research,
>> we are living in the world that James
Burnham warned us about that when you
have the volume and velocity of
information that there's going to be
warfare at the level of what can anybody
believe.
>> And so I the key thing that I take away
cuz I think it's going to have the
biggest impact on us as a planet is that
when you have manufactured consent,
meaning people really can control the
narrative. There's only so many ways to
convey something to the general public.
And so, um, editors of newspapers, they
get together, politicians get together,
they essentially collude and they tell
us, "This is the world.
>> Yeah. This is what happened. This is the
story. We're sticking to it."
>> So, you certainly were not making
contact with the truth, but everybody
had a limited set of places that they
could go to find this information. And
it allowed us to move forward reasonably
well, certainly here in the west.
>> And that felt amazing. So you have
freedom of speech. People can challenge
the orthodox narrative if they want, but
they always end up looking like cooks.
And you're basically able to keep a
narrative moving forward. And something
like the assassination of JFK
sort of bubbles in the background all
the time of people saying that it's a
conspiracy theory. But it's very hard
for people to get all of the information
out in any sort of credible way. they
they lacked the alternative media sphere
that we have now. And so because of
that, the average person just marches
forward with their day, feels like they
understand everything. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
There's like these crazy guys off to the
side and they say some stuff every now
and then, but the reality is I
understand what the world is. I
understand how it works. When I act in
accordance with the narratives, I'm able
to get along with my life. That's all
going away. It that that's all gone
away. And given that that's gone away, I
don't think we yet understand the
ramifications of a world that simply
cannot come to a consensus. Now, this is
where I have to plant the flag and say
um truth is not easy to discern and that
truth is probably
uh the wrong thing to pursue because
you're we are not built from a humans
don't have the sensors to accurately
predict what is true.
>> And so we're always looking at
approximations. We're always looking at
um shortcuts, cognitive shortcuts,
cognitive illusions. So people are
familiar with optical illusions, but I
think that there are cognitive
illusions. And I think for the most
part, when you look at life, because our
physical body makes it impossible to
perceive truth, right? My favorite stat
to remind people of, you only see
0.0035% 0035% of the available
electromagnetic spectrum, which means
you see the world's most tiny fraction
of what's actually there. Okay? So,
you're already abstracted. Once you get
into human behaviors and all of that,
it's going to be 98% interpretation and
2% facts. So, it's like this thing
happened, but what does it mean that
that thing happened? So, I'll give you
an example to bring it back to Charlie
Kirk. So, in in fact, show the tweets
that uh Charlie Kirk sent.
>> So, we're starting at the very beginning
and we'll uh we'll we'll break it down.
So, right here is where um Candace Owens
reveals personal text from Charlie that
shows his intention to split with Israel
simply based on donors, simply based on
how the shift in the um the perception,
I guess, of Israel is changing.
>> Yeah. Show show the clip and then then
I'll walk people through like the beats.
Charlie, and I never said he was going
to, decided one day to become Catholic.
It would have financial implications. So
Charlie writes in this group chat, "Just
lost another huge Jewish donor." Just
lost another huge Jewish donor. 2
million a year because we won't cancel
cancel Tucker. I'm thinking of inviting
Candace. Then the person replies to him,
"Ug." And then Charlie writes, "Jewish
donors play into all the stereotypes. I
cannot and will not be bullied like
this." He then continues, "Leaving me no
choice but to leave the pro-Israel
cause." And then the other person
responds, "Please don't invite Candace.
That might feel good short term, but
it's not good long term in my opinion."
Okay, so obviously a very brief excerpt.
She had gone to um her audience and had
said, "Hey, I have these texts." She
originally did not show them. Uh, and
actually she may have shown them
straight away, but nobody believed that
they were real. And you had people all
over the internet going, "If she can
prove that those are real texts, I'll
give her every dollar I've made from uh
every dollar the Jews have ever paid
me." I mean, it was like really wild
stuff like that.
>> Uh, and
>> then lo and behold, let's play the next
clip. the uh partner of Charlie Kirk
comes on and says, "Yeah, that actually
is real."
>> So, this is Andrew Calvette, the current
president of Turning Point USA, and I
think he's been taking over the show.
Like, he's been doing the last couple
episodes. I don't know if that's a
permanent move, but this is him
authenticating the text from Canones
>> to address some of the things that have
been going around on public, namely
about a text, a group text chain that
has been made known uh and released uh
by Candace Owens. And I just want to
address it headon because uh you know
that was a text grab, a screen grab that
I had shared uh with people. So it it is
authentic and I want to go into it
because I actually am really excited
that the the truth is out there. When he
says that he's excited that these have
gotten out there, he said, "Look, we've
been accused of not trying to find out
what actually happened to Charlie and we
want that more than anybody else." But
people thought from our public behavior
that that wasn't true, but in reality,
we've been cooperating with the
investigation and we didn't want to
spoil anything. And so we're trying to
um just make sure that all of the uh
everything that can go forward with the
formal investigation can and we're not
interfering with that. But now that it's
out and I'm not the one that put it out,
great. Let's talk about it. Yeah. We can
say, listen, this was on our radar. Uh
we made it known to the investigation
immediately as soon as it happened and
so now let's see what happens. So that
obviously to your point earlier brought
a lot of credibility to Candace because
people were dragging her on Twitter
saying that she's just completely lost
the plot from what she's doing with the
um Bridget Macron stuff to this she just
like never found a conspiracy that she
wouldn't endorse.
>> And so for her to be the one that
clearly in the world people are like oh
you've got something hot you want to get
it out. People are going to Candace. Now
I won't lie. She's starting to feel like
Alex Jones feels to me.
>> They do get like a lot of early stuff
from people. People really do go, "Okay,
when I've got that thing that's like too
hot to handle, nobody's going to believe
it. I'm going to go to one of those two
people."
>> But there is something. It does
something to your reputation when you're
always early on breaking conspiracy
theories. Uh so it'll be interesting to
see how this how this plays out. If she
gets vindicated on the um the Mcronone
stuff, it's game over. She she'll be
goated. And it it is interesting.
Listen, I would never do this because I
think people know my foundational belief
is don't uh don't overrust yourself.
Like the things that you could be blind
to are just far too many. Candace
herself could be being manipulated by
somebody deep deep deep behind the
scenes. It's like, yeah, get it to
Candace. Uh so I would just be uber
paranoid about that kind of thing. But
anyway, it's fascinating as somebody
commenting on all this stuff to watch
like how far out there she's putting
herself. So, I've said this before and
I'll say it again. She is the commentary
version of Michael Sailor and it's like
if her bets all pay off, she is going to
have all the credibility in the known
universe. However, this is a very
high-risisk strategy. Okay, so that
happens.
>> She's all in. She's all in.
>> She's all in. She is testic like that.
That is for sure. She maybe some of
those are even being placed inside. Like
this is wild wild stuff. Uh so this lent
a lot of credibility for him to come out
and say, "Okay, that's real. I don't
know how she got it. I think he said
those words, but don't hold me to that."
>> But anyway, acknowledges that those were
screen grabs that he took that he put
together. This is real. Um so Charlie
really did say that and it I would say
that is pretty bombshell. Uh for
somebody like me that's always been on
the outside of the Jews and I've just
always found this fascination weird. Um
I will be very curious to see how this
plays out because um it it is true that
humans in general that governments
specifically they will for sure
manipulate anybody in any way that they
can. I don't think that's in any way,
shape or form unique to Israel. But
Israel is in such a precarious PR
position. If it ends up coming out that
this is what they did, oh my god. Like
this would be this would be freakish.
>> Even even just to save face, you have to
you have to like react big to it. Um but
the plot thickens even still. So as
we're connecting those threads, Candace
Owens has text that she would there was
some descent in Charlie Kirk's Turning
Point USA camp. The president came and
confirmed that. Here is a video of her
expressly saying that Charlie was
fearing for his life days, weeks before
he was actually murdered.
>> Three people told me off record, two
people who have this in a written
communication from Charlie, uh, one who
is a Turning Point USA donor and I would
say very much one of the white knights
in this.
The very day before Charlie Kirk died,
he expressed that he thought he was
going to be killed.
He told these people, "I think they're
going to kill me." Okay? He had not
expressed that to me. So, I am telling
you this based off the testimony of
three people. And I am saying this
because I hope that these people who I
think are good will be inspired to come
forward with that. What she's intimating
here is that I have been given even more
information than I can tell you that I
have specifics.
>> There are three people that have
confirmed these specifics. It's my
understanding she said one of them did
so in writing.
>> And I am saying I'm not going to betray
that. They told me off the record and as
a good we need a new word for what
>> you can't call it journalism.
>> That doesn't feel good. Uh, but it is
some conspiracy.
>> It's a new era of something. We'll be
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let's get back to the show. People are
bringing her information. She really is
able to show people um behindthe-scenes
stuff that's turning out some of it to
be valid. And so
what I want to see is basically like
will the people actually come out
because she's trying to use the like
listen I'm not going to rat you out so
if you want to stay invisible go for it
but you know who you are. I know who you
are. I want you to do the right thing. I
think you're a good person. Right? So
she's trying to pressure them to come
out and say the stuff.
>> Uh which obviously would be amazing. But
>> somebody really did kill Charlie. So, I
can understand why people would be
tense. Presumably, Candace believes she
knows who these people are, and she is
intimating, at least how I read it, that
those same people have been making her
life a hell. Uh, but nobody's naming
names yet. So, all right, let's play it.
>> But I went ahead this week and sent
around a life insurance policy of sorts
of sorts, a package rather to people
that I trust. a package filled with text
messages, emails, private
communications, videos, and private
legal documents. So, if anything happens
to me, you guys will know exactly who it
is that has a making my life a living
hell over the past couple of years.
People that are trying to bankrupt me,
trying to bankrupt me and my family that
are threatening us to sue us. Everything
that Kanye said was so real. Okay, I'm
now at that point where you look back
and you go, "Man, Kanye was right. He
was really saying something. about what
it takes to lose
comes back and we're like, "Yo, Kanye
was early, bro.
>> He was early.
>> Kanye did it again."
>> That was Kanye's undefeated. Yo,
>> the wildest thing ever.
>> And he he would be intolerable. We
wouldn't be able to tell him anything.
>> Will be as in future. In the future,
>> you just he's just going to have the
shady glasses on. He going to bring them
back.
>> But are we in that timeline, dude? That
will be the most insane thing ever.
Okay. Anyway, this is all hearsay right
now, but let her keep going. She's got a
dead hand switch.
>> Or custody of your own soul. Just leave
me alone. Let me say what I believe and
you say what you believe. Fight fair.
Why do you always have to make this
threat to bankrupt people?
>> She has a point there. It's like uh the
process is the punishment. That is an
amazing quote. The process is the
punishment. Like there are people that
have enough money that they can Yeah,
whatever. or it costs a couple million
to go in and fight this for the next 2
or 3 years, whatever, doesn't matter.
>> And just bankrupt the other person.
>> Yeah. And they'll just literally make
your life a nightmare. First of all,
it's extremely stressful. And then on
top of that, it's very expensive. And if
you're in a position where you're
vulnerable, then it's like financially
vulnerable.
>> Then you're just like, at some point, do
I cut bait and run? Because would I
rather the whole world think that I'm
wrong and me just go do another career
and not be millions of dollars in debt
or do I fight this all the way knowing
that I could still lose either legally
or in the court of public opinion
>> and now be the millions of dollars in
debt and having lost.
>> It's wild. And so people coming after
someone like her presumably. Listen, we
don't know who it is. So this could all
be made up in her head. But uh that
certainly is a real strategy. Whether
that's being done to Candace or not, it
is a real strategy. Uh and many a very
wealthy person, organization, government
have run that kind of strategy before.
So we certainly know that's a legitimate
thing that can happen. Now whether it's
happening to Candace, I don't know. But
again, we're back to these sort of vague
claims. Uh, but I think it's going to be
all eyes on this story for a while. But
let her keep going.
>> Think happens to me. They have my
explicit permission to release it all.
Detonate it all. Expose all of these
people in politics and in the movement
who behave like this behind the scenes.
It's necessary. And I highly recommend
every single person that is out there
that has a platform and is going through
things and scared do the same. Send
everything around to about eight people
that you trust. And I mean I I've ranged
it. I sent it to journalists.
>> Someone somewhere is like eight people.
I got to take it out people. Okay. To
Andrew Tate. They won't know where it's
coming from.
>> This is going to be wild, man. This
already is wild. Okay. You are at the
beginning of something very big.
>> And uh a year from now, people can play
this clip. I'm telling you that when you
have the amount of information getting
out into the world that we have now,
something is going to break. I don't
know precisely what that's going to be,
but things are going to get wild. Humans
need a shared narrative in order to
march forward together in lock step. In
fact, I'm so I'm writing right now a
deep dive on the collapse of America.
And it's really weird. I wanted to sort
of eject out of it. Um, obviously in my
typical fashion, I'm trying to show
people a way forward, like this is how
we navigate this, well, but the more I
tried to say, okay, wait, it's really
not this bad. Like, it's not happening.
It uh it really does become undeniable.
I'll let people judge for themselves.
It'll be out in a week.
>> But the need for a shared narrative is
part of how we move forward well. And if
we don't get a shared narrative, we will
not be able to move forward well. And
the bad news is I can I do in the piece
state very explicitly what I think the
shared narrative for America needs to
be. Uh I even use the word we need to
indoctrinate our children. And I'll let
people decide for themselves whether
they think what I'm suggesting we all
collectively decide we're going to
indoctrinate kids with is good or bad.
Um but I don't see another way like we
we really do. It can't be forced from
the top down. It's got to rise up from
the bottom up. Uh, and admittedly when I
was writing the things that I was
writing, it's like I end the paragraph
going, "Look, I know how cheesy that
sounds, but it's like if we don't do
that, we're going to be in trouble." And
I have almost no faith that as a
collective, we'll be able to march
forward with a shared narrative. I think
shared narratives are born out of pain.
>> And I think a country has to go through,
I mean, this is China's rise.
>> China first had to go through a century
of humiliation, their words. And with
that, they were able to galvanize people
with a shared narrative. And now that
they have a shared narrative and things
are going well, it's like you can't stop
them. So, we're wildly prosperous, but
because we're declining, even though
we're still ahead of basically everybody
on planet Earth, that decline feels some
kind of way. And we absolutely do not
have a shared narrative. And we have um
this is going to be a weird word. We
have quote unquote allowed people to
bring all these fracturing negative uh
narratives, which you have to cuz
freedom of speech for me, I I'm prepared
to live in whatever world freedom of
speech brings me. And if it brings me
this where we're dealing with all this,
so be it.
>> Uh I have a very strong position on that
if people want to debate it. But um
we're going to live in that world. But
because we have allowed for all these
competing narratives about what America
is, what it means to be an American,
where we're headed, where we've been,
um, we can't move forward unified. And
there's a phenomenal Thomas Soul quote.
I'm going to paraphrase it. Uh, but the
quote is, "There has never been a claim
made with so much conviction that lacked
all evidence
more than the claim that diversity is
our strength." Mhm.
>> And he's like, diversity is not our
strength. Diversity is the thing we have
to overcome in order to move forward
together unified. Unity is our strength.
So the question is when you celebrate
diversity to high heaven, how do you
move forward together with something
cohesive? And you have to.
>> Let us jump into the Steven Miller on
CNN uh debate. And since the day we came
in, ICE officers have been subjected to
a non-stop campaign of physical violence
and harassment. Every single day, every
night, they come, they fight, they
physically attack for what purpose. Is
it the case that as Pritsker frames it,
you are profiling brown people?
>> That is the It's such a Oh, what a dumb
question. The illegal aliens who are
here are taking jobs away from blacks.
They're taking jobs away from Latinos
and of course they're committing.
>> So, it's not a dumb question and the
only honest answer is I certainly hope
so because if you are not playing the
odds that like if you know illegal
aliens like
that's where you're going to start. So
from an efficiency standpoint, boys and
girls, can we just call a spade a spade?
But obviously he can't say that. And so
I mean kudos to him. The administration
would have lost their minds. But to me,
when he laughed and said, "What a dumb
question." That felt so fake.
>> Yeah.
>> So, uh, yes.
>> And I want to say that they
>> Mexicans are being profiled. I'll just
tell you that right now. And I've got a
Mexican right here. Uh, and we walk Eric
to his car to make sure that he doesn't
get I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm
kidding.
>> No, but there is this sentiment now
though that it's the stop and frisk stop
and frisk equivalent. For those that
don't know, New York City, there was
trying to cut down on crime. Every time
a cop seen somebody that they suspect,
they could stop them, frisk them right
there on the spot. No questions asked.
Yeah, it listen, it's horrible. So, I
think it's also that Yeah.
>> Yeah. horrible.
>> Mhm.
>> Logical.
>> Um I don't know if you also seen this
weekend over um when ICE they blocked a
bunch of cars blocked.
>> I need to let him finish. He's got more
spicy stuff.
>> There isn't actually a threat that these
demonstrators are going to overthrow the
government. Are you concerned that that
response weakens your legal argument?
No, they they are actually as we speak
trying to overthrow the core law
enforcement function of the federal
government. Bors, this is I think what
we're talking past each other. When ICE
officers have to street battle against
Antifa, hand-tohand combat every night
to come and go from their building. when
they try to exit in a vehicle, when they
are swarmed and surrounded and they try
to tip the vehicle over. When people
bring weapons to an ICE facility to try
to engage in direct violent assault
against ICE officers, what is the
purpose? It is to prevent immigration
and customs enforcement from carrying
out the mission the American people
elected them to do. Their objective is
to make it impossible for ICE to carry
out ICE enforcement. When in our history
have we tolerated unlawful riotist
assemblies night after night around FBI
buildings or ATF buildings or DEA
buildings? This is the textbook
definition of domestic terrorism using
the actual and imminent threat of
violence to keep federal officials from
doing their jobs. And unless we send in
troops and resources, then we will
continue to bleed federal law
enforcement resources in these street
battles. It's absurd. It's
unconstitutional. must be put down. You
>> you cited uh title 10 a moment ago and
under that statute you need either a
foreign invasion, a domestic rebellion
or a disturbance that inhibits the the
ability for law enforcement uh to carry
out federal law, but ISIS is still
conducting operations.
>> I think these guys are like way reaching
to call this stuff an insurrection. Um,
it it feels like a classic case of they
threw that at us and so we're going to
throw it back at them and feels uber
childish, but I really don't understand
why. Like the I think it was in
Portland, the argument was like, bro,
it's just the city block.
>> Wait, what? Like you you've knowingly
let protesters take over a city block
>> that are like blowing things up,
lighting uh fireworks, uh harassing the
ICE officers. Like it's what? Like if
you would just go in and break that up.
And that was the part that I was hoping
that we could find. Um
>> somebody said we cut right at the best
part. So hey
>> Oh, is he about to get even spicier? We
keep going.
>> Hold on. Let's play.
>> Hasn't been overrun. It seems like local
officials are fairly in control of the
operation if I still able to execute its
mission. Is it not?
>> Do you have any idea how much of ISIS's
workforce and resources have had to be
rep prioritized? How much of the joint
terrorism task force's resources have
had to be rep prioritized to fight these
domestic terrorists? Do you have any
idea how many resources are spent? You
keep trying
to call them terrorists. They
>> No, if anything, I'm understating the
severity of the situation. What issue
was more central in 2024 than turning
back the border invasion? And since the
day we came in, ICE officers have been
subjected to a non-stop campaign of
physical violence and harassment every
single day. And outside the Portland
field office in particular, every night
they come, they assemble, they fight,
they try to impede movement, they
physically attack. For what purpose? Cuz
we had an election, Boris. We had one.
What's the purpose? to use actual
physical violence to change the result
of the election to say you cannot turn
back the border invasion. So they're
they're not doing it to change the
results of the election. They're doing
it because they want to resist your
policy.
>> Uh so that certainly goes too far, but I
really cannot wrap my head around the
fact that people are um they're just
okay with like, yeah, we're going to
have people like going that ham like
peaceful protesting all day every day.
love it the most. But once you start
being riotist, then the government
should 100%
come in, break that up, tell people to
go home, you can come back when you can
like protest peacefully. Period. End of
story. Like there people act like
protesting means that there are no
limits to the thing that you can do as
long as it's a protest. That's not how
this works. It's like there are certain
ways that you can and can't do this.
>> Yeah. Uh I think he he's at the last
point. Let's let it go a little bit
more. Do you have any idea how many
resources we have had to reddesate to
deal with terrorist?
Let me ask the question. Let me ask the
question. You you make the case that
these are terrorists, but in what we've
seen thus far, the actual incidents of
people inciting violence and not
responding to law enforcement attempting
to disperse them are not an open
rebellion. I mean, again, you you you
make this characterization as though
they're terrorists. And I do wonder if
it is potentially a problem in the
future for Republicans. If a Democratic
president someday calls the National
Guard to a red state over what they see
as open rebellion, but is what amounts
to a demonstration that gets rowdy? I
mean, is that posting pictures of their
kids because it's a demonstration? They
have a sniper on top of a building
firing a high caliber rifle at a nice
facility because it's a demonstration
and they are engaging a vehicle ramming.
>> But the National Guard is being sent to
Texas. National Guard isn't being sent
to Dallas where that sniper was.
>> Because the Dallas Police Department and
the governor of Texas Well, you walked
right into that one. Have responded to
every call for assistance and help. They
gave a standown order in Chicago and
they gave a standown order in Portland.
Do you realize that there's 11,000
federal law enforcement officers in
Oregon? That's larger than the size of
the FBI. Local and state police are
resourced to deal with this kind of
riotous assembly, but they have refused.
They've been given a standout order. So,
>> they've arrested 70 people.
>> Well,
>> so it's wild. He goes on to say that
they have a 911 call where they are it's
on record them getting the standown
order. It's wild.
>> I know a PTA meeting hates to see Steven
Miller coming. Like I just
>> a PTA meeting.
>> Yes. A parent teacher like conference.
>> I know what PTA I just feel like Steven
will be the worst. Like he has to be the
worst at like dinner where it's like
well I just ordered the salad and I feel
like this is an intrusion and you guys
like he's definitely one of those like
let's go to a birthday party and
everybody split the check and he's like
well guys I don't really drink that much
so I'm going to get my bills set. Like I
get those vibes from him. Y'all get what
I'm saying? Like it's just something
just the Yeah. Like his whole point. All
right. Uh he's way too over the top for
me. But uh here here's the thing that I
I'm not sure that I understand the sort
of um generalized take on this.
>> Like the push back.
>> No, no, no. You you cannot have people
come into your country illegally.
>> And to me, like if we're going to focus
on a conspiracy, let's focus on the fact
that for 4 years we had an open border.
That is insane. So it what I want
answers as to why people think. So you
look up at the night sky, you see the
star, open border. What what story are
people telling themselves about that?
Are they this is just compassion and
America is an amazing place and we want
to make sure that we welcome everybody
in. Uh if that's you, you're a [ __ ] So
now I'm like you you're not attached to
the real world. You don't understand how
many ways that that is going to go
wrong. So even if that's the answer,
that's stupid. Uh if it's like we want
to import cheap labor, it's like and
then at the same time you're going to
notice that wages have stagnated. Okay.
So you're offshoring jobs as fast as you
can, you're onshoring cheap workers as
fast as you can. What like that's also a
problem. Uh, so it's like I this this is
one where everybody who cares about
young people, the kids, the next
generation, however you want to think
about it. If you care about wealth
inequality, you've got to look at this
and go, "Okay, this was so catastrophic.
We've got to address this." And people
seem to get lost in all the minutia, all
the details instead of going, "Okay,
this is a problem." So the fact that
people are protesting this at this level
that this is the thing that we've got to
talk about like people having sniper
rifle trained on the building like that
they're trying to dox ICE officers. What
is happening right now? I can't figure
out what they're actually fighting for.
>> Mhm.
>> So that's the part where I'm like this
doesn't make sense. This does not make
sense. It is a massive problem. It's
part of the underlying economic issue
that's making life in America so
difficult. And so the very people who
part of the reason that they're so angry
is because of the economic woes cannot
step like over to the side and look back
at it and go, "Oh, I get how uh one of
the biggest problems that we've created
is we have robbed the average worker's
ability to negotiate." Well, and ironic.
>> Is is that the immigrant's fault though?
I feel like
>> that's part of it. You have a onetwo
punch. If you want to know why workers
lost the ability to negotiate wages, it
is very simple. You outsource jobs and
you imported people that will do the
jobs that we have here for cheap.
Because listen, if the cost to mow your
lawn is uh twice what we're paying now,
then it's twice what we're paying now.
There is a point at which people say,
"Oh, I actually want that thing done and
so I'm willing to pay for it." But
instead, what we did, and I remember
like I'm old enough to remember when
nobody had house cleaners except wealthy
[ __ ]
>> Yeah.
>> And now, like,
>> man, I see people making 200 grand that
have a housekeeper. It's like, what? 200
grand in 2025 and you have a
housekeeper? What are we talking about
here? And that is because we have said,
"Hey, we want to bring in a bunch of
immigrants that will work for really
cheap." Rather than going like, let's
just say that we're willing to bring in
whatever 500,000, a million, two
million, whatever. Pick your number.
>> Uh, if you're going to bring in
immigrants, then what should we care
about? If you want to freeload, what
should we care about?
>> No, no, no, no, no. We're not escaping
that. If you want to freload, there is a
real answer. I even gave it at the
beginning of the podcast. If you just
want a freeload, you will import
entrepreneurs because entrepreneurs
generate tax revenue. But we're not.
We're importing cheap labor. And so by
importing cheap labor, we've created
this mythology that well, Americans
aren't going to do those jobs anyway.
That's [ __ ] If you pay them enough,
Americans will do jobs that are outright
[ __ ] dangerous, let alone boring or
quote unquote demeaning. It is merely a
gap in what people are willing to pay.
>> Yeah. So either we don't care about that
thing, having someone come in and clean
your house, mow your lawn, whatever.
Which, hey, back in the [ __ ] ' 80s,
that's what kids were for. So I have
mowed more lawns than I care to talk
about. I have done more house chores
than I care to talk about. So it's like,
listen, you can't just keep importing
cheap labor. You can't keep outsourcing
high-end manufacturing and expect
workers here to have the ability to
negotiate because like I can always find
somebody that'll
>> I agree with that. And those sentences
said together make sense. However, in
the context of immigration and why
people are upset, I feel like those are
different people controlling that
because the H1B1 visas aren't the same
demographic in my opinion of the people
that are fighting for immigration or
more lenient borders.
>> Unfortunately, it's a very similar
setup. So, uh, an H-1B visa should work
in the following way. You find the
talent that you can't find here. You pay
whatever you need to pay because that
person is worth their weight in gold.
That's why you went all the way to
[ __ ] New Delhi to find them and you
import them here and you're like, "Oh,
thank God. I could not I literally
couldn't find this person here because
America's not training people to do
that. America doesn't want bear with me.
Bear with me."
>> Uh I'm saying this is what it should be.
It isn't this. Okay.
>> So, it should be this.
Instead, what it is is, oh, I'm going to
go get just an average engineer for 20%
or less and I'm going to bring them in.
So, again, you're making it impossible
for American workers to negotiate
because you're like, "Oh, you won't do
it for that amount? Say less, fam. Got
you. I'm going to go get somebody that's
cheaper." Now, I have brought people in
on an H-1B visa and legitimately, it's
because I cannot find the person here in
the US. doesn't mean they don't exist,
but I can't find them. For whatever
reason, they don't want to work in my
company. Whatever. I've in no way,
shape, or form thought, "Ooh, this is
how I'm going to get a cheaper worker."
So, it can work well. There's no reason
like for that not to be a thing. We
should want America to be the place that
the best and the brightest the whole
world over come to. And if people would
understand that the problem is the
government is stealing all of that
innovation led to flation. So, we want
to collect the smartest people from
around the world. And that is good for
us because you're going to drive costs
down. But instead, what ends up
happening is none of that gets passed on
to you. We just pay in the most
inefficient way possible for everything
under the [ __ ] sun. And now all of a
sudden, inflation just keeps going up.
And your life is not better. Your life
is measurably worse. But it's measurably
worse because of policies. It isn't
measurably worse because we're
attracting the best and the brightest.
We're not. We're importing the cheapest
labor we can find.
>> Copy. Um, I kind of want to start at the
beginning of this because I feel like
I'm starting the argument on third base
and I feel like we should we should
start at the beginning. Yeah, we should
kind of ramp ramp it up a little bit
because
>> in context of the Steven Miller clip
right now, we have open borders. This is
terrible. It's terrorism on the local
levels.
>> I understand the there's your your
affinity to hate protests and riots and
we need to
>> Yeah. You you you've been on the on the
a peaceful protest. It has to look a
very certain way. When it goes outside
those lines, you think Law and Order
should step in. Is that a more accurate
representation?
>> I like Law and Order. Tom likes Law.
>> Tom likes Law and Order. Cool.
>> So, I get where how things should look
like and them not looking like that. I
understand that.
>> Yep.
>> Now, let's go to the next layer. On one
side you have ICE who for the first time
I can remember and I follow politics
since Obama the first time. I've never
seen masked
like law enforcement officials
>> are able to patrol uh communities.
They're not read rights. They're thrown
in the back of vehicles and disappeared.
>> So to me that's like like state sanction
right after 9/11 we were straight
kidnapping people. Your your [ __ ] now
that's not defending it. No, no, but
yeah, but that was that was an engage of
terrorism. It's a terrorism. Once once
you're terrorist, your rights are gone.
>> I'm telling you, he is literally saying
we view these guys as terrorists.
>> illegal immigrants are now terrorists.
>> Uh, no, he's not saying that. He's not
conflating those two issues. He's saying
people attacking ICE are terrorists.
>> And what I'm saying is it's not the
people attacking that are getting thrown
in the patty wagon by the mass people.
It's the Abua that works at the dry
cleaner that just happen to be outside
when the ice trucks went. say the Abua
is also getting thrown in the patty
wagon, but I think these guys really
want Antifa. Like they would go after
the protesters first. Like they're not
going to knock the protester back so
that they can get Abua into the van.
They're going to let go of Abua and just
beat the life out of that guy, which
these are not good things, but this is I
think would be their they would much
rather fight against that person who
they perceive as a Democrat lunatic
>> uh and just beat them. But I I think
what ends up happening now though is
when we have Steven Miller um the most
caringest person in the Trump cabinet
when he comes on and starts pushing dem
uh deportations as if the left is scared
of deportations when we deported more
people with Obama. Obama was able to
deport people without mass without patty
wagons without all these things. So I
don't necessarily think it's a function
of these people don't want people in
their country or we're arguing on it's
how we're doing it.
>> Here's the thing. We were not in a
populist moment when Obama got elected.
When Obama got elected, I stood next to
uh I don't know why it's always an
important part of the story for me, but
I stood next to Jared Leto at an
airport. Not that he has any idea that I
even exist, but we were standing next to
each other and we were looking up at the
TV screen. We're like, "Holy [ __ ] Obama
got elected." Like it it felt some kind
of way. Like it really did feel like
hope and change. It was awesome. And so
he comes in with that vibe. Of course,
if he's like, "Listen, we just got to do
this in his suave ass way." And yeah, we
weren't in the economic dire straits
we're in now. We had a president that
felt presidential. It felt like hope and
change. And he's telling us we got a
deport. He's telling us we got a [ __ ]
drone strike. People were like here for
it.
>> So it's a very different time that we
live in now. And if you think of the
official that comes to power as
representing what's going on in the
subconscious of the like popular
zeitgeist, things will start to get a
lot clearer. So Trump is the thing that
has sprung forth from the imagination of
the populace. Now we want a strong man
who's going to slap the opposition
around. That's what we want. That's what
people want in a populist moment. Like
as far back as you go in history, you're
going to find this over and over and
over. So of course you're going to get
your Steven Millers. Of course you're
going to get people who are like, "Yeah,
mask up." But you're also on the other
side. You're getting people that are
like dox the [ __ ] out of them. We're
going to get counterbalance. Yes, dude.
We we are racing away from each other.
This is why I am desperate with my deep
dives especially like I am just trying
to get people to understand you must
find your way to the middle. I get that
you don't want to be in the middle. I
get it. It's compromise at a time where
you don't want to compromise. I fully
understand.
>> And yet I'm not confused. I'm saying you
still have to find your way back to the
middle. You have to find a way to work
with these people that you perceive as
lunatics because they need to find a way
to work with you and they perceive you
to be a lunatic. And so it's like, hey,
>> we're we're in a family.
>> Mhm.
>> Divorce is a lot worse than
reconciliation. We've got to find a way
to reconcile. So in a populist moment,
yes, you're going to have the people
that are up there with the sniper rifles
aimed at the ice building. Yes, you were
going to have ICE people wearing masks
because they know they're getting doxed.
Yes, you're going to have people trying
to dox their family. Yes, you're going
to have people say things. I just saw a
tweet yesterday where the guy finished
it off by saying, "Don't die slow or
anything." So, it's like people
>> people are unhinged there. Not everybody
obviously there's far more lovely people
than there are problematic people. But
the problematic people now are dictating
policy. It's that's what's driving the
vibe. that's what's driving the national
conversation. And so once you understand
that, that is a it is not fair to say,
well, Obama acted one way and Trump acts
another. They are both essentially
figments of the imagination of the
public. They are the person who said and
did whatever they needed to say and do
to get elected in that moment. They are
the person that had the temperament in
that moment to succeed. Now, it you
don't have to go far to find people that
would be like, "Obama's the one to blame
for this." Like, he spouted all the
racial rhetoric. He made everything
super divisive. Everything came down to
race. And so that played into it. And I
will just say once again, all that
matters, fix the [ __ ] economy. And if
you fix the economy, all the other stuff
will recede into the background. Once
again,
>> let's jump into a reaction. Um the job
market um has recorded one of the
biggest losses in years. Um it's
interesting, too, because I know you're
kind of at the front line of this with
Zero, the founder. You're seeing a lot
of new entrepreneurs and people being
forced into entrepreneurship now. And
with these job numbers for the last
couple months, it seems like that is
going to be a growing pattern as we keep
losing jobs.
>> Yeah. I mean, listen, I think that we
are I think we've been in a stealth
recession for a year or more.
>> Wow.
>> So,
>> we are witnessing the biggest job loss
in years, which is going to force the
Federal Reserve to continue cutting
interest rates. The official jobs report
by the government was supposed to be
released on Friday, October 3rd.
However, because the politicians could
not agree on a government funding bill
on time, the federal government has shut
down. And consequently, the Bureau of
Labor Statistics did not release the
reports.
Therefore, people have been relying on
the ADP jobs reports, which at least
gives us insight into the labor market
situation in the private sector. And for
the month of September, the ADP report
shows that the private sector lost
32,000 jobs. This was the biggest
decline in 2 and 1/2 years. Another
reports that we'd like to look at,
regardless of whether the BLS jobs
report is released or not, is the
Challenger report.
This is on page one of the report. And
in the chart, I've highlighted the
months of 2025.
It says, "So far this year, companies
have announced 946,426
job cuts, the highest year to date since
2020."
>> That is 55% higher compared to the same
time period in 2024.
And on page two of the report, it says
it's very likely job cut plans are going
to surpass a million for the first time
since 2020. Again, we're currently at
946,000. So, I would say that surpassing
that amount is very likely.
And it says that previous periods with
this many job cuts occurred either
during recessions or during periods of
transformative technology.
So for here I mean of course there are
so I think what he said at the end is
really the bangers that it's either been
in times of recessions or transformative
technology. So I know a lot of these job
cuts are coming from AI being onloaded
to a lot of these software and tech
companies. Some of them is just the co
money is running out and the
overinflated economy is coming back to
life. Um, in general, how are you
feeling about the jobs report, the jobs
situation in
>> I mean, it'll be good to get the Bureau
of Labor statistics and uh get the quote
unquote official numbers, but yeah, none
of this is surprising. This is terrible
news. um we
we are in a position right now where you
basically have whatever seven companies
that represent most of the gains of the
S&P 500. So you can look at the stock
market and think everything is roaring,
but the reality is that that's not
really what's going on. That um
inflation is hitting everybody hard. Uh
that people have felt pinched for years
now. Um and when people start feeling
pinched, they start slowing down their
expenses. when only 10% of the world own
93% sorry 10% of Americans own 93% of
the assets in America uh you just don't
have enough people spending money
>> uh the individual debt in America is
insane trillions and trillions and
trillions and trillions and trillions of
dollars uh so it's just people are so
hamstrung right now that um yeah you're
you're going to see more and more and
more of this especially as we realize
that the jobs that were gained were in
the government sector and so they're not
producing anything. Um, and
that just makes inflation worse that
when you're overspending on the
government that you're going to have to
end up reducing some of these jobs. So,
I mean, we'll see how bad this gets. Um,
but it we're we are trending in a scary
direction.
>> There's no doubt about that.
>> What how would you like equate the
government like okay, say the economy is
a cake, right? Do you think that the
jobs report is like the flour, the eggs,
or is it more so the icing and there's
other factors that are driving these
jobs reports? Cuz I know a lot of times
we look at the jobs report, we say this
is bad, economy bad, check, but should
there be other things in this cake
recipe that we should look at that might
impact
>> where the jobs go matter a lot. So you
start getting into flour and eggs
territory. If this is in jobs being
created in the private sector, that is
an incredibly good leading indicator. It
isn't the thing itself, but GDP
technically isn't the thing itself
either. Um, it's really you're looking
at a confluence of factors. Are real
wages going up? Huge. Uh, is inflation
steady at a minimum at a very low level?
That would be ideal. I think we all know
I want to see it come down. Uh, where
are interest rates? What's the average
price of a home? like you start looking
at that like basket of goods and you get
a pretty clear picture and right now
just take them one at a time uh jobs are
in freef fall. You're realizing that
most of the jobs we thought we had
gained we hadn't actually gained because
they were just in the private sector and
we've been revising numbers down like
crazy. Um the uh economy is not growing
certainly not at the rate that we
expected it to or traditionally have
been um able to look at. The uh